...and if the final appeal goes against apple it will coincidentally be blacklisted for an entirely unrelated and new reason shortly thereafter.
Not if a court decision or a new law forces Apple to finally allow sideloading apps on iOS.
Fortnite will be blacklisted by Apple until all appeals exhausted
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Re: Fortnite will be blacklisted by Apple until all appeals exhausted
#42So now Tim says he won't come back to iOS until they're allowed to link directly to the external payment option from the app. My understanding of the court order was that Apple only had to allow apps to tell users that external payment was an option, not that they had to be able to link directly to it.
Here's the exact language from the ruling:
> Accordingly, a nationwide injunction shall issue enjoining Apple from prohibiting developers to include in their: Apps and their metadata buttons, external links, or other calls to action that direct customers to purchasing mechanisms, in addition to IAP.
> Nor may Apple prohibit developers from: Communicating with customers through points of contact obtained voluntarily from customers through account registration within the app.
Full ruling [PDF]: https://s3.documentcloud.org/documents/21060696/epic-v-apple...
Re: Fortnite will be blacklisted by Apple until all appeals exhausted
#43Earlier quoted context omitted.
Savvy is one way to put it. As an app developer it simply makes me not want to work with Apple at all, but of course I'm forced to for some reason.
No one is forced to work with apple. I've been developing software for 15 years and never once touched xcode or iOS. Working with apple is a choice you make.
Yes well good for you. I'm not sure what kind of software you're developing but it obviously isn't consumer facing mobile apps. So perhaps your anecdata is irrelevant in this case, yes?
Apple is a gatekeeper that no one who is buying their phones cares about. People buy iPhones because their friends have iPhones, that's it. But Apple treats developing for Apple as a special privilege and locks down their massive ecosystem. It should be illegal at the scale Apple has, but it isn't.
So yes, we are forced to work with Apple in order to be competitive in industries that Apple has no business controlling. You don't have that problem with whatever you develop because (presumably) Microsoft doesn't exploit Windows' market advantage in the way Apple does.
Re: Fortnite will be blacklisted by Apple until all appeals exhausted
#44Earlier quoted context omitted.
No one is forced to work with apple. I've been developing software for 15 years and never once touched xcode or iOS. Working with apple is a choice you make.
Yes well good for you. I'm not sure what kind of software you're developing but it obviously isn't consumer facing mobile apps. So perhaps your anecdata is irrelevant in this case, yes? Apple is a gatekeeper that no one who is buying their phones cares about. People buy iPhones because their friends have iPhones, that's it. But Apple treats developing for Apple as a special privilege and locks down their massive ecos…
> Apple is a gatekeeper that no one who is buying their phones cares about.
I don't buy Apple devices primarily due to the way they administrate the app store and how they treat developers.
I would consider buying an iPhone otherwise.
So yes, there are people who care.
Re: Fortnite will be blacklisted by Apple until all appeals exhausted
#45Earlier quoted context omitted.
No one is forced to work with apple. I've been developing software for 15 years and never once touched xcode or iOS. Working with apple is a choice you make.
Yes well good for you. I'm not sure what kind of software you're developing but it obviously isn't consumer facing mobile apps. So perhaps your anecdata is irrelevant in this case, yes? Apple is a gatekeeper that no one who is buying their phones cares about. People buy iPhones because their friends have iPhones, that's it. But Apple treats developing for Apple as a special privilege and locks down their massive ecos…
I write consumer facing software among many other things. I do not and will not write iPhone software. Apple users can access a (single, Apple-provided) web browser.
Re: Fortnite will be blacklisted by Apple until all appeals exhausted
#46This is simply savvy maneuvering by apple. Frequently these cases are appealed and new terms introduced to the judgement. Apple doesn’t want to give away any negotiating position until this is fully resolved.
Savvy is one way to put it. As an app developer it simply makes me not want to work with Apple at all, but of course I'm forced to for some reason.
Why? I'm excited that a billon dollar company is not treated differently than an indie. I would have hated to negotiate specific terms with Apple and get a bad deal like the way it happens with cloud providers, for example.
IMHO, if the commission of Apple or any other rule is to be changed, it should change for everyone(a regulation maybe?). I hated it when Epic simply steamrolled the external payment rule. I don't like others getting away with stuff simply because they can, I find it unfair.
Apple could have let it happen, then maybe a few more giants like Netflix, Google and Amazon would have done and as a result we would end up with 2 tier business environment, like the way it is for most of the stuff outside of the AppStore.
Re: Fortnite will be blacklisted by Apple until all appeals exhausted
#47It appears Epic asked to be back to get Fortnite on the Mac App Store but wasn’t going to release an iOS version of Fortnite. The Mac App Store has different terms but uses the same developer account. I think epic may just be trying to prove a point with this action and didn’t expect to be reinstated.
Epic's email to Apple also indicated they would not remove the code supporting in-app purchasing, but rather disable it server-side so that it remains hidden.
I don't think you read the same email I did. He said they "can't", not that they "would not". His wording indicating that they are unable to, your wording indicating they choose not to.
I would suspect being unable to update the iOS versions of Fortnite might, oddly enough, be linked to it having been removed from the app store and their account being banned. If their account were reinstated and Fortnite allowed back into the store, I don't know what technical hurdles would remain preventing them from updating it.
edit: Sweeney wrote: "Though we can't update the Fortnite version that users still have on their iOS devices, we've disabled Epic payments server-side[...]". This reads to me that he's stating how things are currently. That, they don't have a mechanism to update Fornite. Doesn't even read that they won't, if able to.
Re: Fortnite will be blacklisted by Apple until all appeals exhausted
#48This is simply savvy maneuvering by apple. Frequently these cases are appealed and new terms introduced to the judgement. Apple doesn’t want to give away any negotiating position until this is fully resolved.
Savvy is one way to put it. As an app developer it simply makes me not want to work with Apple at all, but of course I'm forced to for some reason.
Don't forget the long history of "Sherlocking." If you make a utility that enhances the experience enough, they'll simply imitate it and give you the middle finger.
Or a $99/year fee to give away FOSS projects...
Re: Fortnite will be blacklisted by Apple until all appeals exhausted
#49Epic, Steam, and Framework should team up to build a user centric phone which runs Arch not Android and runs all their games.
Re: Fortnite will be blacklisted by Apple until all appeals exhausted
#50No Apple is definitely not abusing their market position by controlling (and taxing) the access to millions of customers.