I think the question here isn't "is this a good laptop?", but rather "is this business model sustainable for the company?". I truly hope so..
The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used
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Re: The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used
#302>That tool – a small screwdriver – is also sufficient to upgrade the CPU CPU isn't up-gradable without switching out the entire mainboard, which I'm fine with, once I get an AMD version that is :)
The CPU is not socketed/replacable because intel simply does not sell socketed laptop CPUs. If there was a socketed alternative, I'm sure it would be in the framework.
What is the distinction between 'laptop CPU' and 'desktop CPU' if not BGA (or whatever it is) vs. socketed packaging though, really? Power consumption?
Wouldn't it be nice if there just 'CPUs', and you could pick whatever was appropriate for your desktop or laptop. Sure some would maybe only make sense in one package, but there must be some considerable overlap. I use my desktop for work because it has upgradeable RAM and I needed to do that, not because it has a beefier CPU than is available in a laptop.
Re: The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used
#303Been extremely happy with mine the past couple months. The little modular port attachments seemed like a novelty at first, but now it feels absurd that you'd buy a laptop with a bunch of "hardcoded" ports that you can't ever change. The only real Linux related quirk I've run into so far is that you have to disable panel self refresh (it's on by default and causes stuttering). Other than that tiny thing I pretty much…
Maybe I need some convincing here. How is the "modular port" concept any different than a universal port with dongles (i.e., how Macs have been since 2016). To me the fact that the port attachments are recessed is little more than a gimmick. Especially as all of my devices have transitioned to USB-C anyway, dongles/"modular ports" feel more like a stopgap measure than one requiring a permanent form factor change.
Yeah - I think Apple's approach is the right tradeoff, though I admit I think it's cool from a nerd that likes gadgets perspective.
If there's enough of a market for that that they can survive that's cool, but I think there's a reason it's not the default design (that isn't some cynical one about planned obsolescence).
Re: The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used
#304Earlier quoted context omitted.
Literally everybody in my company (a large enterprise) uses a laptop as their main workstation. They work with them docked at their desks, but then unplug them to take them to a meeting room, a shared working space, etc. Outside of work, 90% of people I know have a laptop as their main computing device at home. Very few have a desktop PC - those are the PC gamers. Your anecdotal experience doesn't match with my anecd…
My anecdotal experience matches yours. I work for a smallish business in an active growth phase, and the onboarding process for every employee starts with "Welcome to the company, here's your laptop."
Right, which doesn’t actually contradict what I said in any way. I did not say that companies are giving out desktops, genuinely not sure why everyone is pretending to the contrary.
Re: The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used
#305Earlier quoted context omitted.
The author does address that > The environmental consequences of that system weren't lost on me, even given my very good track-record of re-homing my old computers with people who needed them.
That's not really addressing it. It's just acknowledging it.
If it causes other people not to by new laptops, it kinda is addressing it. (As long as we assume the people getting the old laptop would have bought a new laptop, which might or might not be the case.)
Re: The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used
#306First exciting laptop I've seen in a very long time!
Would love to see ethernet (if it's even possible with this thinness) and a regular SD port.
Re: The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used
#307I still remained baffled by the popularity of the laptop. Literally everyone I know works with them fixed in one location; their desk. Yes, some people do need mobility, but this appears to be a minority of consumers. We could’ve had all this repairability and modularity years ago if most consumers just admitted that really they wanted a desktop all along. It also fixed complaints about keyboards.
Really? This has maintained true for you even during the pandemic? I don't know a single person who uses their laptop in one place. Hell, every one of my co-workers has been at home or in the office with their machine at least a couple times over the past month.
Yes. It has maintained true for me throughout the entire pandemic.
Laptop ergonomics are catastrophically bad. Doing any meaningful work on them for any length of time without my keyboard, monitor, and mouse just plain sucks, so I don’t do it.
My personal machines (gaming and non) are both desktops. I’ve never wanted to move them, and they cost me a fraction of what an equivalent laptop would have.
Re: The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used
#308Looks gorgeous - i wonder how the trackpad is though, otherwise seems to be a solid contender to a Macbook...
It's pretty good. The click is definitely better than my 16-inch MBP (it's physical instead of motor-driven). Moving the cursor feels precise.
Re: The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used
#309Earlier quoted context omitted.
Linus (the "tech tips" one) said something that sticks in my mind: "The only reason other companies can't do this - and Framework proved it - is because they don't care."
Another quote from Linus that's relevant: "Imagine being an engineer at a company at Apple, and it being your job to design the mechanism that makes it so that machine cannot start up unless the chassis is fully sealed. Apple spent actual fucking money making sure that product would not work unless it is in the exact chassis they shipped it in." That goes beyond not caring.
That company only inherited the worst from its deceased co-founder!
Re: The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used
#310It feels like for years we were constantly told by these corporations "it's impossible to have slim, tiny laptops and make them customizable", and I guess at some level I believed that, and just accepted that laptops with upgradable components were a thing of the past. After seeing the framework, I'm more than a little annoyed that I fell for this. They proved you can have a slim, clean laptop that's somewhat modular…
> we were constantly told by these corporations "it's impossible to have slim, tiny laptops and make them customizable"
Because it’s true. The thing is “power users” and “regular users” look at that tradeoff differently. The bad part of economies of scale is that they reward conformity (you can pick your model T in any color, as long as that color is black).
The framework would a hard time competing in the general laptop market, but luckily for them, they don’t have to. There’s a niche for specialized products and they are taking advantage.
I’ve looking at their laptops since they announced, I’m just hoping they can release a Ryzen one, and then I’ll be on the fence between theirs and whatever Apple has to show for a ARM pro laptop (14”-15”).