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The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used

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Re: The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used

#91

Post by rcthompson »

ashtonkem wrote: post #50

I still remained baffled by the popularity of the laptop. Literally everyone I know works with them fixed in one location; their desk. Yes, some people do need mobility, but this appears to be a minority of consumers. We could’ve had all this repairability and modularity years ago if most consumers just admitted that really they wanted a desktop all along. It also fixed complaints about keyboards.

Even when I'm home 90% of the time during COVID, I use my laptop in lots of places: my desk, my bed, my dining table, my kitchen counter, my couch. I can't drag my desktop setup all around my apartment like that.

Re: The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used

#92

Post by m463 »

topspin wrote: post #33
tombert wrote: post #25

It feels like for years we were constantly told by these corporations "it's impossible to have slim, tiny laptops and make them customizable", and I guess at some level I believed that, and just accepted that laptops with upgradable components were a thing of the past. After seeing the framework, I'm more than a little annoyed that I fell for this. They proved you can have a slim, clean laptop that's somewhat modular…

Linus (the "tech tips" one) said something that sticks in my mind: "The only reason other companies can't do this - and Framework proved it - is because they don't care."

I would clarify that - it is not in their best interests to care.

what they want is:

To sell you a laptop with a current cpu and memory.

If you are "price insensitive" they will allow you to get a better cpu or more memory for a significant upcharge.

next year, they want:

To sell you a laptop with a current cpu and memory.

They do not want you upgrading the cpu or memory yourself

They do not want you to add next-year's cpu yourself next year.

Re: The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used

#95

Post by AlexandrB »

CivBase wrote: post #76
epistasis wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, the other reason is that customers don't care either. I certainly don't. The last desktop build I made 5 years ago hasn't had a single component changed in that entire time.

The only a tiny minority of people probably care about the upgradability of their laptop. Many many more probably care about the repairability of their laptop, though.

I think you're right. Many people "care" about repairability in the market sense of getting pissed off that a keyboard replacement costs >$500 for some reason. The right kind of marketing could bring them onboard.

Re: The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used

#96

Post by TwiztidK »

bluedino wrote: post #31
ad133 wrote: post #7

This looks really cool, but the author... is... replacing their laptop every year ? Like, I'm writing this on an 8 year old MBP that has survived as my round-the-house driver because it still does everything well. My daily driver is getting on a bit now (3yr) and my desktop only just got replaced after 5 years. Forget the cost, but the waste!

>> replacing their laptop every year? Not really that uncommon especially with a MacBook Pro where a new one is released...every year. How much sense it makes, that's another story.

Many products are released on a yearly basis, but very few people are upgrading every year.

Re: The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used

#97

Post by dreyfan »

kvark wrote: post #94
dreyfan wrote: post #90

> The third, a giant, heavy Carbon X1 A 2019 Carbon X1 (14") weighs 2.4lbs and the laptop they're drooling over starts at 2.8lbs.

They must be thinking about X1 Extreme, I assume. I've been using one, and it's giant.

okay, that'd make a lot more sense. The X1 Carbon was heavily advertised as being thin and lightweight.

Re: The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used

#98

Post by technofiend »

the_other wrote: post #44

But why the dongles? The go against all the principles of the rest of the design. They’re proprietary, consumable, and they waste space in the chasis. They limit what you can do with the USB-C they pass through too.

Only a guess but they also act as a sacrificial device in place of the motherboard's USB-C connector. I've read here on HN that Macbook USB-C adapters regularly fail.

Re: The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used

#99

Post by turtlebits »

ashtonkem wrote: post #50

I still remained baffled by the popularity of the laptop. Literally everyone I know works with them fixed in one location; their desk. Yes, some people do need mobility, but this appears to be a minority of consumers. We could’ve had all this repairability and modularity years ago if most consumers just admitted that really they wanted a desktop all along. It also fixed complaints about keyboards.

You must be out of touch. In the last 20 or so years of work (~8 employers), I have never had a desktop as a primary work machine (I've had desktops as a secondary machine). My primary personal machine has also been a laptop in that time frame.

Re: The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used

#100

Post by jeffbee »

tombert wrote: post #88
jeffbee wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Framework is larger and weighs more than contemporary machines that have larger displays (e.g. ThinkPad X1 Carbon 9th generation), and it has worse performance and shorter battery life because soldered-in RAM isn't some kind of scam, it's actually much better . In short, it was not a lie that you get smaller, lighter, and better laptops with integration. You do, in fact, get all of those things.

Is that a property of the components being soldered in, or just a property of the fact that Framework cannot get access to the highest quality components on the market? Genuine question, I know very little about electrical components.

They have to use DDR4-3200 to be able to put the RAM on a stick. Integrated systems can use LPDDR4x-4267. You can't put that on a stick. It's a trade-off. It turns out it takes extra power to drive high-speed signals across long traces with connectors.
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