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The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used

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Re: The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used

#81

Post by 1MachineElf »

epistasis wrote: post #39
topspin wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Linus (the "tech tips" one) said something that sticks in my mind: "The only reason other companies can't do this - and Framework proved it - is because they don't care."

Well, the other reason is that customers don't care either. I certainly don't. The last desktop build I made 5 years ago hasn't had a single component changed in that entire time.

In an alternate universe where the Framework concept was commonplace, you might say the same thing about a laptop built 5 years ago.

Framework means you can custom-build it, just like your desktop. Reparability aside, that alone is a milestone.

Re: The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used

#82

Post by imglorp »

tshaddox wrote: post #54
tombert wrote: post #25

It feels like for years we were constantly told by these corporations "it's impossible to have slim, tiny laptops and make them customizable", and I guess at some level I believed that, and just accepted that laptops with upgradable components were a thing of the past. After seeing the framework, I'm more than a little annoyed that I fell for this. They proved you can have a slim, clean laptop that's somewhat modular…

Do you actually have any example of a corporation that makes laptops saying that it’s impossible to have slim laptops that are customizable? I would be very surprised if this ever happened, but I’m willing to be proven wrong.

iFixit has repairability scores for products. Eg this Surface gets a 1 out of 10 because MS used adhesives among other problems. They traded off repairability for thermal, rigidity, and mechanical concerns.

https://www.ifixit.com/Teardown/Microsoft+Surface+Go+Teardow...

Re: The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used

#83

Post by nsriv »

moepstar wrote: post #38

Looks gorgeous - i wonder how the trackpad is though, otherwise seems to be a solid contender to a Macbook...

With Windows installs, they use Windows Precision drivers and feel at least as good as a Surface Book trackpad. YMMV with Linux however.

Re: The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used

#84

Post by collinvandyck76 »

TOMDM wrote: post #28

These laptops would be an instant buy from me if I could get a new AMD chip instead of the Intel CPU's.

Same here but for fan noise. Since I've gotten the m1 macbook air, I don't think I can go back to a laptop that runs hot and needs a fan.

In the event that I must get a non-m1 laptop, I can definitely see myself buying the framework laptop and putting ubuntu on it.

Re: The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used

#85

Post by fabianhjr »

flatiron wrote: post #57
MMS21 wrote: post #49

>That tool – a small screwdriver – is also sufficient to upgrade the CPU CPU isn't up-gradable without switching out the entire mainboard, which I'm fine with, once I get an AMD version that is :)

ive seen a lot of requests for an AMD version but i always see people complain about AMD's linux support. Do you plan on running windows? If you are planning on Linux is the support really as bad as people complain. I say that because intel's linux support seems to me as top notch. ive never really had driver issues that i can think of

Hey, AMD (Zen2 3800X) and Linux (NixOS - 5.14.6) user here; other than a weird bug once on temperature reading I haven't had a single issue between Linux and AMD.

Re: The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used

#86

Post by squeaky-clean »

epistasis wrote: post #39
topspin wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Linus (the "tech tips" one) said something that sticks in my mind: "The only reason other companies can't do this - and Framework proved it - is because they don't care."

Well, the other reason is that customers don't care either. I certainly don't. The last desktop build I made 5 years ago hasn't had a single component changed in that entire time.

But imagine if your next desktop build required you to also throw away your SSD, monitor, keyboard, mouse, and speakers. You can also re-use a case in future builds, and re-use a high quality PSU in future builds.

I also don't really care to replace individual components in my systems, but being able to upgrade laptop hardware without throwing away the chasis and storage seems pretty nice to me.

Re: The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used

#87

Post by pessimizer »

epistasis wrote: post #39
topspin wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Linus (the "tech tips" one) said something that sticks in my mind: "The only reason other companies can't do this - and Framework proved it - is because they don't care."

Well, the other reason is that customers don't care either. I certainly don't. The last desktop build I made 5 years ago hasn't had a single component changed in that entire time.

Whereas any dating of when my last desktop build was would be deceptive because they're replaced piece by piece. The closest occasion I can give is when I went from one to two desktops, but even then half the guts of the one I had before went into the new case, and were replaced in the old case with new purchases.

I mean, I've met people that only wear underwear once or twice before throwing it away, too, but I wouldn't say that's normal. People would generally rather replace a drive, processor, ram, or screen than spend 10x as much on an entirely new system. They don't because the manufacturers make that option difficult or impossible.

People didn't love VCR/TV combos, and people don't love this. Manufacturers love this.

Re: The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used

#88

Post by tombert »

jeffbee wrote: post #67
tombert wrote: post #25

It feels like for years we were constantly told by these corporations "it's impossible to have slim, tiny laptops and make them customizable", and I guess at some level I believed that, and just accepted that laptops with upgradable components were a thing of the past. After seeing the framework, I'm more than a little annoyed that I fell for this. They proved you can have a slim, clean laptop that's somewhat modular…

The Framework is larger and weighs more than contemporary machines that have larger displays (e.g. ThinkPad X1 Carbon 9th generation), and it has worse performance and shorter battery life because soldered-in RAM isn't some kind of scam, it's actually much better . In short, it was not a lie that you get smaller, lighter, and better laptops with integration. You do, in fact, get all of those things.

Is that a property of the components being soldered in, or just a property of the fact that Framework cannot get access to the highest quality components on the market?

Genuine question, I know very little about electrical components.

Re: The Framework is the most exciting laptop I've used

#89

Post by GordonS »

epistasis wrote: post #39
topspin wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Linus (the "tech tips" one) said something that sticks in my mind: "The only reason other companies can't do this - and Framework proved it - is because they don't care."

Well, the other reason is that customers don't care either. I certainly don't. The last desktop build I made 5 years ago hasn't had a single component changed in that entire time.

It's not just about upgrading components, but also about having more choice during initial specification. It's a real PITA trying to find laptops that have almost everything you want, and inevitably you need to make multiple compromises.

And it's also about replacing broken components without having to ditch the whole laptop.

I'm really excited about how Framework could potentially shake up the whole industry!

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