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Why doesn’t natural immunity count in the US?

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Re: Why doesn’t natural immunity count in the US?

#511

Post by favorited »

TimTheTinker wrote: post #442
fernandotakai wrote: post #415

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i really don't understand why booster shots are a "political discussion" i have normal flu booster shots ever year -- and that's fine. why not for covid?

Every year influenza mutates. The flu booster shot is actually a full vaccination based on the leading 2-3 variants they predict will be dominant in the coming flu season. Also, flu vaccines are based on weakened viral particles, not mRNA transcriptions of key viral proteins... so the two really aren't comparable.

> flu vaccines are based on weakened viral particles, not mRNA transcriptions of key viral proteins

Thankfully this is changing. Moderna is entering trials for an mRNA vaccine for seasonal flu. The faster development time for mRNA vaccines will mean more time to study the emerging flu strains before committing to which to include in the booster.

Re: Why doesn’t natural immunity count in the US?

#512

Post by [deleted] »

SavantIdiot wrote: post #467
jowday wrote: post #292

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wish I could say that if authorities hadn't lied about, say, masks or this stuff with natural immunity, things would gone a lot better and people would have behaved much more rationally about COVID, but I don't think that's true. I've got family in a small town in the south - the countermeasures they took against COVID basically amounted to Wal-Mart closing for a weekend in March. Most of the people there had made…

> if authorities hadn't lied about, say, masks or this stuff When did authorities lie? The position on masks changed over time as data was acquired. Unless you mean when the FDA/CDC was worried about a run on masks, which they were right about. But I think ascribing a malicious intent to that learning process is disingenuous. The only people that have made literally malicious claims have been people on the far-right,…

[deleted]

Re: Why doesn’t natural immunity count in the US?

#513

Post by Meekro »

tshaddox wrote: post #416
pasquinelli wrote: post #253

Earlier quoted context omitted.

hasn't it blown up in their face everytime the authorities tried to be strategic with their messaging (a nice way to say play silly games)?

I don't know, has it really "blown up in their face," or do people just use supposed examples of "strategic messaging" to support their preexisting commitments? In other words, are people actually changing their decisions based on specific examples where public health officials allegedly lied or used strategic messaging, or are they simply using those examples to justify their own actions?

People's opinion of the trustworthiness of authorities wasn't a blank slate when COVID began. Some people already believed (based on their life experience) that authorities are untrustworthy, and therefore chose to be skeptical of their claims during early COVID. Then examples of authorities lying about COVID/masks came out, which convinced those people that they were right all along. They'll be even more skeptical of the authorities next time.

Re: Why doesn’t natural immunity count in the US?

#514

Post by slg »

rootusrootus wrote: post #365
bedhead wrote: post #322

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Amen. We have been so unbelievably myopic with COVID it truly hurts my head. Even today, ask someone who's COVID-obsessed, "What exactly is your longer-term plan here?" and watch as their mind breaks down. Too many people have completely stopped thinking about what they're trying to achieve and how they're going to do it. Half the country is just stuck, focused on short-term and no attention paid to anything else and…

> Half the country is just stuck, focused on short-term and no attention paid to anything else and it's freakin disastrous. Which half?

Some vaccination rates[1]:

Democrats: 88%

Republicans: 55%

Republicans who support party more than Trump: 62%

Republicans who support Trump more than party: 46%

Biden voters in 2020 general election: 91%

Trump voters in 2020 general election: 50%

Let's not "both sides" this issue. It should be obvious who is to blame for the US's less than stellar vaccination rates and it isn't well-intentioned but manipulative messaging coming from health officials.

[1] - https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/meet-the-press/nbc-news-pol...

Re: Why doesn’t natural immunity count in the US?

#515

Post by pfdietz »

m-p-3 wrote: post #506

My mother-in-law works in Healthcare as N auxiliary nurse and caught COVID-19 at the beginning of the pandemic. She was officially recorded as positive by the govt (through a periodic PCR test at work, and received a quarantine order). She received one dose since. But even though they're saying an infection is protecting as much as one vaccine dose, they aren't acknowledging it in the vaccine passport as "adequately…

I wish I could get a third dose. She in effect has had a booster.

Re: Why doesn’t natural immunity count in the US?

#516

Post by walterbell »

m-p-3 wrote: post #506

My mother-in-law works in Healthcare as N auxiliary nurse and caught COVID-19 at the beginning of the pandemic. She was officially recorded as positive by the govt (through a periodic PCR test at work, and received a quarantine order). She received one dose since. But even though they're saying an infection is protecting as much as one vaccine dose, they aren't acknowledging it in the vaccine passport as "adequately…

EU recognizes natural immunity for travel to/in EU and national health pass checks.

Re: Why doesn’t natural immunity count in the US?

#517

Post by pfdietz »

jowday wrote: post #376
bedhead wrote: post #322

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Amen. We have been so unbelievably myopic with COVID it truly hurts my head. Even today, ask someone who's COVID-obsessed, "What exactly is your longer-term plan here?" and watch as their mind breaks down. Too many people have completely stopped thinking about what they're trying to achieve and how they're going to do it. Half the country is just stuck, focused on short-term and no attention paid to anything else and…

>Half the country is just stuck, focused on short-term and no attention paid to anything else and it's freakin disastrous. The pandemic is largely over culturally and mentally for pretty much all of the country - I'm in the middle of San Francisco and the only real remaining enforced anti-COVID measures are flashing your vaccine card before going into bars, masks inside of gyms, and masking and demasking when you ent…

California is ahead of the rest of the country on Delta. Rates have fallen considerably there. They are only just starting to fall elsewhere; in some places they are still rising.

Re: Why doesn’t natural immunity count in the US?

#519

Post by arwhatever »

isolli wrote: post #252
jowday wrote: post #189

The answer is pretty simple - the moment authorities start saying "well, natural immunity is probably just as good as vaccination, we'll accept that as equal to vaccination for passport purposes", a huge segment of the population who's on the fence about getting the vaccine might just opt to wait until they're infected naturally, or, even worse, get infected purposefully (EG, chicken pox parties). Which leads to more…

While not wrong in itself, your comment epitomizes everything that has been wrong with our public health response. Trying to manipulate populations into a desired behavior by lying to them is, as you point out, counterproductive in the long run.

Mark Twain - “If you tell the truth, you don't have to remember anything.”

Re: Why doesn’t natural immunity count in the US?

#520

Post by swader999 »

SavantIdiot wrote: post #467
jowday wrote: post #292

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wish I could say that if authorities hadn't lied about, say, masks or this stuff with natural immunity, things would gone a lot better and people would have behaved much more rationally about COVID, but I don't think that's true. I've got family in a small town in the south - the countermeasures they took against COVID basically amounted to Wal-Mart closing for a weekend in March. Most of the people there had made…

> if authorities hadn't lied about, say, masks or this stuff When did authorities lie? The position on masks changed over time as data was acquired. Unless you mean when the FDA/CDC was worried about a run on masks, which they were right about. But I think ascribing a malicious intent to that learning process is disingenuous. The only people that have made literally malicious claims have been people on the far-right,…

I'd put the whole censorship of debate and deplatforming dissenters in the left leaning media and tech companies. That made compliance very difficult for me personally as all trust was gone after that.
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