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Why doesn’t natural immunity count in the US?

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Re: Why doesn’t natural immunity count in the US?

#131

Post by RHSeeger »

peteradio wrote: post #69
RIMR wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Despite having an account since 2018, they have only posted 5 submissions. 4 of them were posted in the past 3 weeks, and all have to do questioning the viability of the vaccines. I know we want to have a space here to freely discuss things without being dismissed, but I also think enough of us have managed enough websites to understand that this account shouldn't be taken seriously. I'm not saying that they are a bo…

I admit that this has me fired up. But that is really the long and short of the explanation. You see "pushing agenda" I see "championing underrepresented not just opinion but facts in the face of government overreach and media blackout".

> not just opinion but facts

You can even argue that they're not facts, that they're wrong... but the OP is coming from the viewpoint that they appear to be facts. And, as such, it seems the OP is posting in good faith.

Re: Why doesn’t natural immunity count in the US?

#132

Post by syshum »

nobody9999 wrote: post #50
rajin444 wrote: post #8

It's very concerning that the president is saying things like "your refusal has cost all of us" and "our patience is wearing this" when talking to people with natural immunity who have not received the vaccine. As president, he should be looking for every reason to not alienate his own citizens. It seems like he's doing the opposite. I'm not really sure why. My best guess is politics has become all about polarization…

>As president, he should be looking for every reason to not alienate his own citizens. Through the pandemic, there have been ~40,000,000 COVID cases[0] in the US, and ~120,000,000 people are completely unvaccinated[1]. As such, there are more (perhaps much more) than twice as many folks who have not had COVID who are unvaccinated than there are those who have had COVID. Given that huge disparity, it's not surprising…

Pretty sure you numbers are not factoring in children under the age they legally allowed to get the vaccine, because those numbers are way high if you exclude the ineligible

"All Persons" is not a valid statistic

>As such, we know much more about how well vaccinations protect people than we do about how well the immune systems of those who have recovered from COVID will protect from reinfection

We actually do not, given that the effects of the vaccine seems to diminish with time, we currently have no idea how much or for how long. We do not have long term data. This is why there is sooooo much confusion on if you need a booster and when, because the efficacy at 6mo, 1 year, 18mo etc is a big unknown right now

Re: Why doesn’t natural immunity count in the US?

#134

Post by bigcorp-slave »

Pxtl wrote: post #118
bigcorp-slave wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is not a conspiracy to vaccinate more people. The lens you are missing is that the vaccine card is at least somewhat difficult to forge. You can trace the lot number and say, did this person get this dose. But with previous infection, there is a huge camp of people who are just going to lie about it and continue spreading the virus freely. People have shown that they cannot be trusted to act responsibly.

I assume the proposal is that the vaccine card would be a de-facto immunity card, where a test showing a high antibody count would still be logged on your card as an alternative to the vaccine. But the devil's in the details anyways. How long would that be considered good for, since we'll probably be looking at regular annual boosters? Would extremist anti-vaxxers have a perverse incentive to get infected so as to re…

I’d support an immunity card with the same audit trail for antibody test. I think most people would - general common sense suggests that natural infection should be effective. How long it lasts, I guess we’ll need to study that.

Honestly the problem here is not the science. It’s the big clump of people who have turned being against the science into a part of their identity. Every time I think we have hit the bottom as a country in terms of the power of ignorance (and evil, on the part of the GOP establishment), we keep going.

What I find especially perverse is that these people are here! On Hacker News! I just don’t understand how someone can be in the technology field and yet so virulently pro-disease. Any comment that points out that IT IS THE REPUBLICANS WHO HAVE MURDERED 650,000 AMERICANS AND ARE ACTIVELY TRYING TO KILL AS MANY MORE AS THEY CAN gets downvoted below zero.

Re: Why doesn’t natural immunity count in the US?

#135

Post by kuraudo »

triceratops wrote: post #113
leifg wrote: post #15

The argument seems fine to me. Let people with natural immunity have the same privileges as vaccinated people assuming they have a piece of paper from a federal entity to prove it. The only argument I can think of against it is: Certain vaccine skeptic people might be incentivized to catch the virus on purpose.

> The only argument I can think of against it is: Certain vaccine skeptic people might be incentivized to catch the virus on purpose. I think that's a pretty important argument against allowing natural immunity in lieu of vaccination. A lot of people will go and deliberately infect themselves. Some of them will die. They will spread it to others. Many will tie up ICU beds, doctors, nurses and other hospital resources…

I know of several people who purposefully went to get the virus in the early stages of 2020: I don't think your worry is very far off the mark at all.

Re: Why doesn’t natural immunity count in the US?

#137

Post by ffggvv »

lmilcin wrote: post #136

Because it is pretty simple to account for who got the vaccine and who did not. And running entire population through antibody test just to find, in most cases, that you still need to administer the vaccine is just wasteful.

i don’t see how it’d be wasteful to know how many people have natural immunity. seems quite useful actually even if we determine they should still get vaccine

Re: Why doesn’t natural immunity count in the US?

#138

Post by gorwell »

DR. GUPTA: "I get calls all the time, people say, 'I've already had COVID, I'm protected.' And now the study says maybe even more protected than the vaccine alone. Should they also get the vaccine?"

DR. FAUCI: "I don't have a really firm answer for you on that."

https://twitter.com/Breaking911/status/1436417459314171904

Re: Why doesn’t natural immunity count in the US?

#139

Post by stefan_ »

cblconfederate wrote: post #121
darthvoldemort wrote: post #21

A recent study from Israel said that natural immunity is an order of magnitude better than vaccine-induced immunity against delta variant. I don't know who to believe, but if that's the case, then the narrative of "well they should get vaccinated anyway" is really freaking suspicious. We need deeper research on this, and the fact that they haven't researched this is truly scary.

13 times actually https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.08.24.21262415v... I think this will be more relevant to vaccinating kids: If this result holds for kids as well, and considering that Covid is not dangerous for kids, maybe kids are better off getting covid

No, of course they are not, hence why we are vaccinating them. This is fud.

(Is this the dumbest argument yet? "If you just get COVID, you will have the best protection against COVID!"? I take it the dead people have the best protection to offer yet?)

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