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China uses anti-fraud app to track access to overseas financial news sites

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Re: China uses anti-fraud app to track access to overseas financial news sites

#51

Post by jszymborski »

rjzzleep wrote: post #43
Retric wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In theory no, in practice yes. They had an active nuclear weapons program that officially stopped just short of completion in the 1980’s. They also currently have multiple nuclear reactors in the country. So, they have the capacity to have produced nuclear weapons in the past or to produce them in the near future, but if they have any is somewhat unclear. Still, I would expect Shanghai to probably get nuked at some p…

No and no. It didn't officially stop just short of completion. The US actively worked to subvert it. Both overtly using the UN and covertly using the CIA. Taiwans nuclear industry was decimated as a result with a lot of the research facilities getting shut down and a lot of aspiring Nuclear scientists leaving the country or switching industries. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taiwan_and_weapons_of_mass_des... https://…

The claims GP made about Taiwan practically being able to develop Nukes is supported by that wiki article, though.

> "There is no evidence that Taiwan possesses any nuclear weapons or any programs to produce them, although it does have the advanced technological ability necessary to develop nuclear weapons as well as the high-tech ability to enrich uranium or process plutonium."

Re: China uses anti-fraud app to track access to overseas financial news sites

#52

Post by president »

trompetenaccoun wrote: post #4

What the CCP's been doing over the past couple of months is worrying. I wish there were a nicer explanation but it almost looks like they're preparing for war, or at least increasing confrontation.

It has escalated in the past few years but they've been preparing for decades. Last month, Chinese warships were spotted [1] near Alaska. I find it strange that these acts of aggression are not known by your average American citizen.

[1] https://www.scmp.com/news/china/military/article/3148725/us-...

Re: China uses anti-fraud app to track access to overseas financial news sites

#53

Post by president »

jack_riminton wrote: post #23

Was the cracking down always the plan for the CCP? use capitalism to rise the tide and then once everything has been modernised take control again?

I don't think there is any plan other than use any tool available to maintain power and control.

Re: China uses anti-fraud app to track access to overseas financial news sites

#54

Post by chunghuaming »

roenxi wrote: post #13
trompetenaccoun wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have friends and family in the Mainland. I've lived there myself for years. The CCP does not want peace, not sure where you're getting this from. First they'll take Taiwan at the first sign of American weakness (which may have happened already). Then they'll go for the rest of the world. It's not even a one party state anymore, it's been transformed into an outright totalitarian dictatorship under Xi. Absolute powe…

China is a superpower. The future is bleak for Taiwan. But India has nukes, Japan can probably produce nukes in short order, Korea is in a state of hyper-militarisation for unrelated reasons and the US, insofar as they are active in the region, have nukes. It doesn't matter what the CCP wants, they might get away with Taiwan but it is hard to see what the follow up would be where Shanghai still gets to have skyscrape…

> The future is bleak for Taiwan.

I keep seeing this argument. Let me explain why Taiwan will be free from China's attack for the next 30-50 years (long enough for Xi JinPing to expire)

- US protection. If there's one thing both parties in US agrees on, it's against China. Biden just emphatically committed protection for Taiwan and peace in the south east Asia. There are many US warships sailing up and down Taiwan straits. There are many military deals and cooperations with Taiwan. TSMC is a critical part of the world's electronic supply chain. Taiwan is a critical part of the island chain strategy to contain China, since it acts as an unsinkable carrier against China.

- United democracies. US and its many allies are now coordinating naval exercises in the Region. Japan. Australia. India. UK, France, and Germany now have warships in the region as well. South Korea and Taiwan are now increasing its military defenses. These firepowers are 90% of the world's military right now.

- China's military is only starting up. It doesn't even have capability to produce its own jet engines or carriers. Its strength lies in the large # of soldiers, which have to be transported. And its large # of ships, which are mostly coast guard/civilian level, and can be sank relatively easily. China's military is about 3-4 generations behind US, and currently is no match for the 10X power from US and its allies

- Taiwan as a fortified island. Fortified islands are hard to take, as evident in the modern war histories. There are only a few times in the year that China can safely cross the straits without fearing typhoons or rough sea. And landing only on a few spots. Especially if the island is armed with the latest war technologies from US, and has the missile capability to strike Beijing, or the three gorges dam which will then wipe out millions of Chinese. Taiwan is now producing domestic submarines, long range missiles, and ship missiles. You'll want to remember that Taiwan has very sophisticated electronic capabilities, so the arms it is starting to produce will be very good.

- China only gets one shot at attacking. After which, it will get economically sanctioned into oblivion by the world economies. Because otherwise Japan, South Korea, and other island nations near China can be attacked with similar attempts as well. Since China mainly imports most of its resources, and is export focused, it will sank into a deep economic depression filled with local riots.

Re: China uses anti-fraud app to track access to overseas financial news sites

#55

Post by xxpor »

ashtonkem wrote: post #25
roenxi wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

China is a superpower. The future is bleak for Taiwan. But India has nukes, Japan can probably produce nukes in short order, Korea is in a state of hyper-militarisation for unrelated reasons and the US, insofar as they are active in the region, have nukes. It doesn't matter what the CCP wants, they might get away with Taiwan but it is hard to see what the follow up would be where Shanghai still gets to have skyscrape…

Japan’s policy has always been to keep highly enriched uranium on hand, which they could use to make nukes in relatively short order. It’s a backup plan in case America stops being the guarantor of Japanese safety against China.

Do they have the wherewithal to pull off a deliverable Teller-Ulam thermonuclear warhead, without doing any atmospheric testing? Does Japan even have SLBMs or bombers?

It takes a lot more to be a credible nuclear threat than just having some U235 sitting around...

Re: China uses anti-fraud app to track access to overseas financial news sites

#56

Post by A4ET8a8uTh0 »

tablespoon wrote: post #49
postingawayonhn wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it is correct that prosperity will eventually bring democracy. Xi sees that too and is busy trying to knock China's wealthy citizens down a couple of notches.

>> I think it is correct that prosperity will eventually bring democracy. > Xi sees that too and is busy trying to knock China's wealthy citizens down a couple of notches. What do billionaire-wealthy citizens have to do with prosperity or democracy (besides the fantasies of pro-billionaire propaganda)?

From that perspective, I can understand why Xi wants to limit power of individuals he sees in US ( they do wield tremendous amount of power ). He obviously understands it is a threat to the system ( and by extension himself ).

I have long argued that too much power in one individual is a bad thing ( and that includes billionaires ).

Re: China uses anti-fraud app to track access to overseas financial news sites

#57

Post by xxpor »

trompetenaccoun wrote: post #16
roenxi wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

China is a superpower. The future is bleak for Taiwan. But India has nukes, Japan can probably produce nukes in short order, Korea is in a state of hyper-militarisation for unrelated reasons and the US, insofar as they are active in the region, have nukes. It doesn't matter what the CCP wants, they might get away with Taiwan but it is hard to see what the follow up would be where Shanghai still gets to have skyscrape…

You can't take on the entire world with bombs and tanks, the Nazis tried that and failed. The CCP has a smarter strategy, they only use force where everything else fails. Like in Hong Kong, they were never going to get the HKnese on their side because no one knows the CCP oppression better than the people of HK, they've had front row seats for decades watching it all in HD. Same goes for Taiwan. They almost successfu…

"bombs and tanks" means something very very different in 2021 than it did in 1942. You have to remember they barely had V2 rockets in WW2...

What actually causes issues for modern armies is relatively low tech guerilla warfare, as we've seen in nearly every war (that any country has engaged in, not just the US) since Vietnam especially, but the hints were there since the second Boer war.

Forget even nukes for a second, I don't think anyone has the stomach for a regular conventional war between modern nation states. We've seen the pictures of what cities looked like in Europe after WW2. Now add modern bombs and missiles. Imagine Shanghai or LA just completely flattened. It's not worth it.

Re: China uses anti-fraud app to track access to overseas financial news sites

#58

Post by ashtonkem »

xxpor wrote: post #55
ashtonkem wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Japan’s policy has always been to keep highly enriched uranium on hand, which they could use to make nukes in relatively short order. It’s a backup plan in case America stops being the guarantor of Japanese safety against China.

Do they have the wherewithal to pull off a deliverable Teller-Ulam thermonuclear warhead, without doing any atmospheric testing? Does Japan even have SLBMs or bombers? It takes a lot more to be a credible nuclear threat than just having some U235 sitting around...

I can't speak to the delivery aspect, but I don't think you'd even need a Teller Ulam thermonuclear warhead to make a credible threat to a neighboring power. But the delivery aspect matters a lot, obviously.

Re: China uses anti-fraud app to track access to overseas financial news sites

#59

Post by cybernautique »

vmception wrote: post #27
jack_riminton wrote: post #23

Was the cracking down always the plan for the CCP? use capitalism to rise the tide and then once everything has been modernised take control again?

Just one of many plans that now has a decent opportunity presented. China can sometimes seem arbitrary but its much easier to think of it as a theme park than what we respect as governments. At a theme park, run by a corporation, you understand there are rules that can be enforced, your participation is limited and conditional, anything exploitative or erotic will be policed swiftly and heavily, and some exhibits are…

I never thought I'd see an unironic invocation of panem-et-circenses[1], especially with regards to a sinofascist regime.

It is extremely incorrect, untoward, and downright harmful to draw parallels between the CCP and, say, Busch Gardens.

In a theme park, run by a corporation, I understand that the proprietors of said park will not: drag me to a detention camp; do the same, or worse, for the unfortunate souls who share my relation; imprison and enslave millions of ethnic/religious minorities; make extremely aggressive overtures against other "theme parks," to the tune of building artificial land to claim (in whole or part) the international commons.

[1] https://www.mccc.edu/pdf/arc141/Bread%20&%20Circuses%20(Pane...

Re: China uses anti-fraud app to track access to overseas financial news sites

#60

Post by pphysch »

trompetenaccoun wrote: post #4

What the CCP's been doing over the past couple of months is worrying. I wish there were a nicer explanation but it almost looks like they're preparing for war, or at least increasing confrontation.

The most plausible explanation [1] is that China is insulating its domestic economy from the coming global financial reckoning, by cracking down on excessive financialization, etc. Either the US Fed will hike rates (taper QE) and crash the financial markets like never before, or they will continue to kick the can down the road with increasingly negative rates and the USD will 'gradually' become worthless. Regardless, the correct play is to limit exposure to the USD system, and historically "closed" societies have the advantage here.

[1] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dual_circulation

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