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September 11, 2001 media synced in real-time

911realtime.org

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Re: September 11, 2001 media synced in real-time

#301

Post by fighterpilot »

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #279
tommymachine wrote: post #274

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure how those things discredit the janitor. Are you as critical of the politicians, who have built their livelihoods off of going around speaking to corporate interests? What about the government officials who put out the 9/11 commission report, and were paid for it. Are they similarly implicated by the act of self promotion? Or does that distinction only apply to the janitors of the world?

> I'm not sure how those things discredit the janitor. He claims there was a massive explosion that shook the walls, caused part of the ceiling to cave in, and other significant effects. The obvious source is the plane impact. If there were multiple explosions of the magnitude he claims, surely other people would have noted them. And of course, the standard conspiracy theory caveats apply: Do you really believe that…

> Do you really believe that their was a massive conspiracy perpetrated by experts

The conspiracy theory about explosives is even more idiotic than that. It's not merely that the conspiracy would needed to have been extremely complicated and involve 10s or 100s of silent accomplices, which is true. It's also that it would have been completely unnecessary and redundant, and is therefore a violation of Occam's Razor.

Whatever the purported political objectives behind a conspiracy to put explosives in the towers, the planes themselves should have been sufficient to achieve those objectives, and so what motivation would there be to tack on yet another entirely different conspiracy (different in terms of operational details, skills required, additional headcount, etc)? You're multiplying the difficulty and complexity of the operation and increasing the chances of getting caught by a good 2-10x, for little benefit due to that redundancy.

> Common sense discredits the story.

They say things like "jet fuel can't melt steel", when nobody even makes that claim. The claim is that the burning jet fuel made the steel weaker. So don't expect them to exercise common sense when they're insisting on these strawmen.

Re: September 11, 2001 media synced in real-time

#302

Post by tommymachine »

polytely wrote: post #202
tommymachine wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You haven't seen how the moral imperative to stop the spread of that disease has been exaggerated well beyond practicality, and used to remove citizens' ability to consent to extremely profitable, taxpayer-funded medical experiments? It's a pretty direct line from what you're saying, (a moral imperative to "be careful") to what governments around the world have been trampling over people rights in order to do, which…

I'm from the Netherlands so not sure about the current US situation, but: Firstly, Ok: I take full responsibility for advocating for a temporary reduction of rights to stop the spread of a novel virus with the aim of reducing strain on the healthcare system. I also think that we made the right choice, waiting for EMA approval before starting vaccinating. Right now here about 77% of the people (17,4 million) has been…

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Re: September 11, 2001 media synced in real-time

#303

Post by mannanj »

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #279
tommymachine wrote: post #274

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure how those things discredit the janitor. Are you as critical of the politicians, who have built their livelihoods off of going around speaking to corporate interests? What about the government officials who put out the 9/11 commission report, and were paid for it. Are they similarly implicated by the act of self promotion? Or does that distinction only apply to the janitors of the world?

> I'm not sure how those things discredit the janitor. He claims there was a massive explosion that shook the walls, caused part of the ceiling to cave in, and other significant effects. The obvious source is the plane impact. If there were multiple explosions of the magnitude he claims, surely other people would have noted them. And of course, the standard conspiracy theory caveats apply: Do you really believe that…

Common sense is a weak argument.

common sense is only common sense when it’s in the favor of your narrative. In the other direction, it’s not. Right?

“Everyone knows the towers collapsed cause we studied it for 10 years. Everyone still asking questions is a conspiracy theorist. Common sense” vs “everyone knows that jet fuel doesn’t burn hot enough to melt structural steel cause we studied it for 10 years. Everyone still believing otherwise is … common sense.”

See my point here with your logic?

Re: September 11, 2001 media synced in real-time

#304

Post by cududa »

Tenoke wrote: post #36

I was 9 and angry that they interupted my tv show to show news (adult stuff) from the other side of the world. 20 years later and I have a better understanding of the situation but in a lot of ways I think everyone reacted and keeps reacting just how the terrorists wanted. It's tragic but if this wasn't in America I likely wouldnt have even heard about the event nor would it be influencing my life this much later due…

I was 10. My classroom “job” was to take the attendance to the office. No one was in the main office, I could hear them in the back room so I wandered back. I got there right as the first tower came down. The way all the adults were screaming, was clear it wasn’t a movie. I stayed for a few minutes listening to the news anchor going over the events of the day before being sent back to class and told not to tell anyone.

My fifth grade teacher, who I’m still friends with today, said she’d never seen a kid with that look. She eventually got me to tell her what happened. I guess I said something like “Americas being bombed. The big building in New York is on fire and the other one fell over and the pentagon blew up.”

I don’t remember saying that, but I do remember how furious she was at me saying that was a horrible story to make up. We had TV’s in each class, she was going to turn on the news to show me it wasn’t true, begged her not to. She called the front office, couldn’t get through (assuming they were still watching TV).

She went on her computer, started crying. Composed herself, dropped whatever we were learning that day and she put on The Princess Bride - still can’t enjoy that movie.

She let me sit behind her desk and we’d attempt to refresh websites to get updates on what was happening, both of us occasionally crying.

They didn’t send us home for a few hours, but it’s always been a weird feeling knowing that of all the 600+ kids in that school, I was the only one that knew what was happening, and only a handful of adults did, the rest going about their day without just sitting there knowing what was happening.

Her and I are still friends to this day, that experience really bonded us. She’d suspected I was on the autism spectrum, my parents wouldn’t get me evaluated, and school was pretty rough for me. I’d have been held back in multiple grades, possibly not even graduate if she hadn’t gone to bat for me with every “problem” teacher I had at various schools in my district year after year, getting me put in “good” teachers for various subjects, getting me into advance classes even though my grades hadn’t previously warranted it, etc.

No idea where I’d be in life had I not wandered into the back office, and her and I had that experience.

Re: September 11, 2001 media synced in real-time

#305

Post by hhhhhrdcc »

ithinkso wrote: post #147

Besides the whole 9/11 thing, if you have 'showdead' set, you see the spam 'bot' in this thread. I always wonder if it's really a bot or someone with a lot of time to waste but let's assume it's someone real... do you know what their end game is? It can't be propaganda because it's clearly a spam and no one read those. Also, not many people respond to spam so I don't think 'dopamine hit' is a part of it. Confusing

Can you link what you are describing?

Re: September 11, 2001 media synced in real-time

#306

Post by adventured »

maybelsyrup wrote: post #215
yyyk wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>do not forget the >360 000 dead civilians the war on terror has cost so far. Most of them killed by the same people the US targeted. Funny how all responsibility is always given to the West even when the people doing the killing are their enemies. >the taliban back then only refused to hand over Bin Laden without evidence presented Also after he publicly confessed, not to mention his previous crimes. Their refusal h…

> Funny how all responsibility is always given to the West even when the people doing the killing are their enemies. It's barely ever given to the west, and never in major media. And when someone in an anonymous internet comment dares suggest we might be morally accountable for vast amounts of innocent deaths - a trifle of a blip of a nothing in the discourse - we can count on certain people getting their feewings hu…

A trifle blip? Hardly. It was exhaustively covered by the largest media outlets in the US for more than a decade.

It was a 24/7 talking point by everyone on the left politically from the day the US invaded Iraq until the day Bush left office. Across all forums, anywhere a comment could be posted.

Google: "nytimes iraq death count" or "nytimes bush iraq civilian deaths"; or any number of dozens of variations on that same premise.

You must have missed the endless media parade about the Bush death count, and deaths from drone strikes. The headlines and discussion were everywhere across social media, mainstream media, on blogs.

Re: September 11, 2001 media synced in real-time

#307

Post by baxtr »

I remember sitting on the other side of Boston Harbour on the eve of September 11th, watching planes start and land while drinking a beer. I have often thought: please, god, take me back to that evening, let me call the police and tell them what will happen the next day. Then I think: they wouldn't have believed me anyway and arrested me instead.

I will never forget the days of chaos that ensued. Boston is close to NYC. We knew back then that things would be very different from then on. For at least a year I would open news pages and except something terrible terrible until that fear faded slowly over time.

Re: September 11, 2001 media synced in real-time

#308

Post by orf »

tommymachine wrote: post #302
polytely wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm from the Netherlands so not sure about the current US situation, but: Firstly, Ok: I take full responsibility for advocating for a temporary reduction of rights to stop the spread of a novel virus with the aim of reducing strain on the healthcare system. I also think that we made the right choice, waiting for EMA approval before starting vaccinating. Right now here about 77% of the people (17,4 million) has been…

[flagged]

life is like, temporary dude. so like just ignore the pandemic and like just focus on freedom man. masks are for sheep and my personal freedom to be able to visit a mcdonalds without a mask means more to me than the potential side effect of indirectly killing someone.

you see i don't care about the endless restrictions of my freedom placed upon me post 9/11, i care about this highly specific and politicised position the media i consume told me to care about because i can score points with the big bad other side! the side that thinks maybe you should not sacrifice a non-trivial percentage of our population without trying to restrict the spread of a virus.

but nah, don't think about all that, think about the big bad medical experiment the big bad government is subjecting us to, think about the endless restrictions to our freedoms that definitely for sure 100% wont ever end and worry some more about the biden administration coming for my guns. fox news told me it's gonna happen any day!

Re: September 11, 2001 media synced in real-time

#309

Post by jokethrowaway »

I'm impressed at how to little the States achieved since 9/11. A lot of war expenses with little results and now an even stronger Taliban, parading with US army war machines.

I remember a joke from 20 years ago: It's 2021, a son and a father are walking in front of Ground Zero and the father says "... and here the World Trade Center was standing, before it was destroyed on 9/11 by Arab terrorists" "But dad, who are the Arabs?"

I guess 10 year old me didn't know how incompetent and/or corrupted by oil money our leaders are

Re: September 11, 2001 media synced in real-time

#310

Post by adventured »

tyingq wrote: post #229
yyyk wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>do not forget the >360 000 dead civilians the war on terror has cost so far. Most of them killed by the same people the US targeted. Funny how all responsibility is always given to the West even when the people doing the killing are their enemies. >the taliban back then only refused to hand over Bin Laden without evidence presented Also after he publicly confessed, not to mention his previous crimes. Their refusal h…

>Most of them killed by the same people the US targeted. That just sounds crazy given that our first retaliation for 9/11 was Iraq. Which had nothing to do with 9/11, and further...no "WMDs".

> That just sounds crazy given that our first retaliation for 9/11 was Iraq.

The first retaliation for 9/11 was not Iraq. That's a really bizarrely inaccurate claim.

The US invaded Afghanistan and removed the Taliban from control of the country by the end of 2001. Operation Enduring Freedom launched in October 2001.

The Iraq invasion was 2003.

The US initially sent its special forces into Afghanistan shortly after 9/11 to work with the Northern Alliance to route the Taliban and pursue bin Laden, and then invaded.

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