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El Salvador adopts Bitcoin as official currency, first country to do so

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Re: El Salvador adopts Bitcoin as official currency, first country to do so

#251
post #220
post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, it's created out of hot air and instead of interest you have crazy transaction fees.

100% BULLSHIT. The fees on Bitcoin, on chain, have been less than 75 cents the entire year of 2021. The average tx on chain the past 9 months has been about 10-15 cents. Unless you stand here trying to tell everyone that 10 cents is a crazy transaction fee. Quit lying, or better yet quit spreading FUD purposely.

Source?

Re: El Salvador adopts Bitcoin as official currency, first country to do so

#252
post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Normal banks already do that 70% of El Salvadorians don't have a bank account [1]. [1] https://datacatalog.worldbank.org/dataset/el-salvador-global...

What you said does not contradict the parent comment. Just because Bitcoin is now a thing in El Salvador it doesn't mean that that missing 70% will now starting using it.

> What you said does not contradict the parent comment. Just because Bitcoin is now a thing in El Salvador it doesn't mean that that missing 70% will now starting using it.

It was alleged this move would let percent "removing anonymity and ensur[e] the government can monitor their population effectively" [1]. Counterargument was that "normal banks already do that" [2].

That is true. But 70% of El Salvadorians don't use "normal banks." They use cash. Cash does not "ensur[e] the government can monitor its population." This Bitcoin rollout does.

So yes, an El Salvadorean using a bank to do business and switching to Bitcoin gives up no privacy. But one using cash does.

[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28447197

[2] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28447562

Re: El Salvador adopts Bitcoin as official currency, first country to do so

#253
post #70

Because they have both Dollar and Bitcoin as legal tender, the result is unclear. In theory, because USD is still cheaper (if Bitcoin is supplied constrained as it is promised), people will trade with USD and hoard Bitcoin. However, when crossing borders, USD is more cumbersome to move around, that may deter people to import products with "cheap" USD. It would be very interesting to observe, whether they will eventua…

> if Bitcoin is supplied constrained as it is promised

To my knowledge, this could only be changed through unanimous consensus across the entire Bitcoin network. That’s possible, but practically speaking this would nearly certainly result in a fork.

Is there another way that the 21m Bitcoin constraint could be broken that I’m unaware of?

Re: El Salvador adopts Bitcoin as official currency, first country to do so

#254
post #243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And let's ignore the actual criminals who legally counterfeit US dollars to finance war all around the world. I've not heard of a legal counterfeiter. How's that work?

The Federal Reserve has a legalized monopoly on counterfeiting US dollars. [0] [0] https://mises.org/library/fed-giant-counterfeiter

Ah—you arrived there by redefining the word. Got it.

Re: El Salvador adopts Bitcoin as official currency, first country to do so

#255
post #246

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By see them working I mean have a working dapp on the mainnet I can use. Not a few static pages and a waitlist.

It is on MainNet, I already own property tokens that are paying me rental cash daily. https://www.lofty.ai/account/register

Ok cool. That is something. I'm not going to give them my ID to try it out but looking at it it seems like they just use basic tokens and then pay to holders, rather than any complex smart contracts. Maybe something like yieldly but with property? At any rate, fair enough that looks like a real business on it which people are at least using, even if I doubt they're leveraging much smart contracts or that there's anything about Algo that helps here.

Re: El Salvador adopts Bitcoin as official currency, first country to do so

#256
post #8

Best part is the President trolling the IMF on Twitter: https://twitter.com/nayibbukele/status/1435263064933285898

Yes that'll show those checks notes professionals. The IMF is of course the entity who had to bail out the entire country of Albania when they all got into a massive ponzi scheme, jailed their finance minister and had a civil war over it.

"Professionals."

That's a funny way to define criminals.

Re: El Salvador adopts Bitcoin as official currency, first country to do so

#257
post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

BTC is quite literally made out of hot air. Burning coal to create hot air to spin turbines is the most common energy source for BTC mining. And "hot air" describes most of it's coals replacements as well.

And yet it still costs far less energy to mine Bitcoin than it does to sustain Petrodollars.

The entire world economy runs on fiat dollars.

Re: El Salvador adopts Bitcoin as official currency, first country to do so

#258

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are using lightning wallets. So no on chain settling. No (extra) trees were harmed for hamburgers (though obviously opening and closing of channels and initial mining it self is energy intensive).

Actually, they are not even using lighning wallets. They are using a centralized payment processor that has personal accounts for users, like any other payment app. This centralized processor happens to use lightning wallets in its backend, but there is no 1:1 mapping of payment_account:lightning_wallet. And since Lightning itself doesn't interact with the blockchain except when you open/close payment channels, there…

The capacity of BTC is so low that if it had universal adoption, every human being could do around one or two transactions in their lifetime.

Re: El Salvador adopts Bitcoin as official currency, first country to do so

#259
post #6

As a country where remittances make up roughly 20% of the GDP, and with remittance fees as high as 20% or more, this could boost GDP by 4-5%. Not surprising to see them be the first to do this. Others will likely follow.

Well if you include the fact you have to pay 1-2% to an exchange to move USD->BTC, and your $0.50-60.00 transaction fee then wait a day or so, and deal with astronomical FOREX risk in the meantime (like today's 30% instant drop in BTC) suddenly Western Union doesn't look so bad. Especially since Western Union actually hands you cash which you have to get out of one of the Bitcoin ATMs that eats 20% of your withdrawal…

What exchange are you using? A major exchange like Kraken charges ~.25% for small traders and lower for bigger ones. You can also buy face to face from someone; if you're lucky someone may need to dump some coin and be willing to trade at par with market.

If I'm an el salvadoran with no documentation in the US I can send my $15k wages for like $40 to any individual in El Salvador (who can now use it as currency once on the appropriate local network) without getting rammed by Uncle Sam's large dong while trying to transfer. It's incomparable to Western Union.

Re: El Salvador adopts Bitcoin as official currency, first country to do so

#260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seems like a reasonable decision to me. I don't see how else the government could control the cartels. Plus it's got to be decent for their economy.

Yes, let's all surrender to the criminals. Embrace the inescapable mad-max future. Maybe the Sicilians should run for office in Italy?

Is civil war forever really the best policy? At some point it makes sense to realize war is costly, both in terms of lives and the economy. When is it time to just try to make the best peace you can?
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