ProtonMail deletes 'we don't log your IP' from website after activist arrested • Hacker News Board

Re: ProtonMail deletes 'we don't log your IP' from website after activist arrested

#291

Post by dane-pgp » Tue, Sep 07, 2021, 4:32 PM UTC

stjohnswarts wrote: post #256

unethical_ban wrote: post #220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree in that, for me, e-mail is almost solely used for business communications and newsletters. However, I don't know of a "timeless", or otherwise decentralized, communication technology so ubiquitous that can be secured like e-mail. Signal seems to be the hip thing, but it's centralized. "Blockchain" communications, perhaps?

That is something I doubt I'll ever sign up for is my email on a blockchain lol unless it's just a hash of the email text or something for "proof" of it's origin/association.

Actually, a blockchain might work as the basis for a distributed email server reputation system. If every provider published their opinion of all the providers they've received emails from, it should be possible to reach a consensus about who the spammers are.

Hopefully this system would provide a useful signal even if it was only adopted by a few big mail providers, and they could pressure newly-registered mail domains to adopt it or face delivery delays. Long-established mail domains would be grandfathered in, so most providers wouldn't have to change anything.

Re: ProtonMail deletes 'we don't log your IP' from website after activist arrested

#292

Post by mark_l_watson » Tue, Sep 07, 2021, 4:36 PM UTC

istingray wrote: post #279

mark_l_watson wrote: post #205

ProtonMail is my main e-mail, so I am positively biased in their favor. I think their advertising copy about not logging IP addresses was poorly done, but their service is private enough for me. It probably doesn’t much matter or make much difference, but I feel OK with using their service, and tweaking my account settings for Google and Apple to the minimum amount of data retention. I feel that people who let corpor…

What's important for you about using Protonmail? Would any non-Google non-Apple email account suffice?

Nothing special about ProtonMail, except it seemed like an "easy choice" after reading the Surviving Surveillance Capitalism book a couple of years ago.

Everyone just needs to make their own decisions on privacy. I feel fairly comfortable with my practices. For me, it is the economic motivation of wanting to reduce the advantage companies I deal with have over me that convinced me to take extra precautions.

Re: ProtonMail deletes 'we don't log your IP' from website after activist arrested

#293

Post by yaris » Tue, Sep 07, 2021, 4:37 PM UTC

istingray wrote: post #265

dathinab wrote: post #152

> stated: "No personal information is required to create your secure email account. By default, we do not keep any IP logs which can be linked to your anonymous email account. Your privacy comes first." And it still holds!! What it didn't stat is that while _by default_ no such information is logged, but if they are legally compelled to they will log such the neseccary information for the email (account?) they are re…

ProtonMail requires a phone number for account creation through Tor. "no personal information"...does it still say that? Let me know where, will email them.

In Sweden you can get a prepaid phone number completely for free: Comviq literally gives away SIMs and to pre-pay you can still use cash. So from this point of view PM is not lying, not one bit.

Re: ProtonMail deletes 'we don't log your IP' from website after activist arrested

#294

Post by istingray » Tue, Sep 07, 2021, 4:38 PM UTC

mark_l_watson wrote: post #292

istingray wrote: post #279

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's important for you about using Protonmail? Would any non-Google non-Apple email account suffice?

Nothing special about ProtonMail, except it seemed like an "easy choice" after reading the Surviving Surveillance Capitalism book a couple of years ago. Everyone just needs to make their own decisions on privacy. I feel fairly comfortable with my practices. For me, it is the economic motivation of wanting to reduce the advantage companies I deal with have over me that convinced me to take extra precautions.

Ah got it. I support Protonmail because I believe in easy to use privacy tools for others like journalists, whistleblowers, and teachers. That's why I want Protonmail to be a leader in this space with clear marketing and communications.

Re: ProtonMail deletes 'we don't log your IP' from website after activist arrested

#295

Post by stilisstuk » Tue, Sep 07, 2021, 4:41 PM UTC

lnxg33k1 wrote: post #235

dylan604 wrote: post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm confused on the lack of naming names. It's not libel if you show the pages being discussed as evidence. So I'm not sure what the cause for the pussyfooting around name and shame.

I bought it from pCloud, and the person I replied to also said in another reply that he was talking about pCloud, so I think we both have had the same experience and it should be ok to name names as one person could be lying but if 2 people who never met each other say the same thing I guess that would make it at least believable

I am fairly happy with pcloud though. Didn't buy for privacy (i use encryption for that), but for cheapness. I am not aware of any violation of trust like what is mentioned here.

Re: ProtonMail deletes 'we don't log your IP' from website after activist arrested

#296

Post by stilisstuk » Tue, Sep 07, 2021, 4:42 PM UTC

rsync wrote: post #280

lnxg33k1 wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah I also bought a lifetime plan from that cloud storage company few years ago, scammed by the marketing page, only to find out somewhere in the settings page that my data were never in switzerland or even in EU but were physically in US, and had to pay to move them to EU, just deleted my account, I guess the swiss thing is just a marketing scam

Ironically, I am in Zurich right now supervising upgrades and capacity increases in ZH4. Our terms of service[1] Explicitly state that your data will never leave the location you’ve chosen. So if you’re still in the market for cloud storage in Zürich, email us. We’ll give you a “screwed by pcloud” discount. [1] rsync.net/resources/notices/tos.html

What did pcloud do?

Re: ProtonMail deletes 'we don't log your IP' from website after activist arrested

#297

Post by istingray » Tue, Sep 07, 2021, 4:47 PM UTC

yaris wrote: post #293

istingray wrote: post #265

Earlier quoted context omitted.

ProtonMail requires a phone number for account creation through Tor. "no personal information"...does it still say that? Let me know where, will email them.

In Sweden you can get a prepaid phone number completely for free: Comviq literally gives away SIMs and to pre-pay you can still use cash. So from this point of view PM is not lying, not one bit.

It's a lie. Including in their home country of Switzerland. To buy a Swiss SIM card, you’ll need to provide proof of identity (such as a passport).

Re: ProtonMail deletes 'we don't log your IP' from website after activist arrested

#298

Post by dylan604 » Tue, Sep 07, 2021, 5:01 PM UTC

lnxg33k1 wrote: post #235

dylan604 wrote: post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm confused on the lack of naming names. It's not libel if you show the pages being discussed as evidence. So I'm not sure what the cause for the pussyfooting around name and shame.

I bought it from pCloud, and the person I replied to also said in another reply that he was talking about pCloud, so I think we both have had the same experience and it should be ok to name names as one person could be lying but if 2 people who never met each other say the same thing I guess that would make it at least believable

Great, so to get the full picture of your point, one must read the entire thread.

My actual point, was why in the world would you not post the name of the company in the original post? What thought processes occurred that suggested you shouldn't provide the name in the first place?

Re: ProtonMail deletes 'we don't log your IP' from website after activist arrested

#299

Post by ikerdanzel » Tue, Sep 07, 2021, 5:02 PM UTC

stjohnswarts wrote: post #253

snuser wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Proton has always been as bad a hushmail

Got any proof of that? Can you decrypt my email that is sitting on their servers? If you are communicating something so precious that not even the sender/receiver and subject line shouldn't be seen then you best not be using ANY EMAIL at all without a couple more layers of security on top of it.

Have you audit their code? Or you truly believe the code is doing what you think is doing based on what they said giving you the impression that is secured and encrypted email? The bent over without a fight. At least old yahoo mail tried that even though furtile. They bent without a sound.

Re: ProtonMail deletes 'we don't log your IP' from website after activist arrested

#300

Post by yaris » Tue, Sep 07, 2021, 5:05 PM UTC

istingray wrote: post #297

yaris wrote: post #293

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Sweden you can get a prepaid phone number completely for free: Comviq literally gives away SIMs and to pre-pay you can still use cash. So from this point of view PM is not lying, not one bit.

It's a lie. Including in their home country of Switzerland. To buy a Swiss SIM card, you’ll need to provide proof of identity (such as a passport).

Either you are confusing Switzerland and Sweden (which were two quite different countries last time I checked) or I'd be very much interested in data on why you see my words about Comviq giving away SIM cards as lie. As you probably know, there are no roaming charges in EU, so if you have a swedish SIM card - you can use it (to receive SMS at least, sometimes answer calls) in any EU country. If you put some cash on it - you can even make calls. Still without providing a single bit of your PI (assuming you bought/stole a burner phone). EDIT: clarification regarding SIM usage.