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An Afghan minister who became a bicycle courier in Germany

reuters.com

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Re: An Afghan minister who became a bicycle courier in Germany

#41

Post by oaiey »

AdrianB1 wrote: post #32
quonn wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you please describe the situation? Are you saying someone asked a question in English and got a reply in German? Or are you saying there was an office with 20 German-speaking employees and one English speaking one and then much of the informal talk was in German? It‘s true, it‘s like that. And that‘s not xenophobic. It may be impolite, depending on the situation. It‘s not specific to Germany as anyone working in…

Simplest example: my first time in Munich I was struggling with the subway instructions, they were all in German and this was before Internet on smartphones and Google translate, so at the entrance of the station I asked several people in English if they speak English and can tell me what ticket to purchase (the different ticket by area concept was completely foreign to me). A couple said yes, I asked the question "w…

Well, considering the fare system in Munich your outsourced a shitty job to them :)

Aside of that: it is rude and I polite but not xenophobic. They can rightfully expect that you speak the language of the country you are in.

Re: An Afghan minister who became a bicycle courier in Germany

#42

Post by oaiey »

jhgb wrote: post #35
AdrianB1 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Simplest example: my first time in Munich I was struggling with the subway instructions, they were all in German and this was before Internet on smartphones and Google translate, so at the entrance of the station I asked several people in English if they speak English and can tell me what ticket to purchase (the different ticket by area concept was completely foreign to me). A couple said yes, I asked the question "w…

Just keep practicing German, in time you'll be AdrianB2 or even AdrianC1! ;)

Underrated

Re: An Afghan minister who became a bicycle courier in Germany

#43

Post by vostok »

baybal2 wrote: post #30
et2o wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Plumbers in NYC can make >200k

In fact, that's more than the prime majority of bankers will ever see. Computer science/coding seemed to have travelled the same trajectory before the stigma faded. A very in demand trade that nobody really wanted to do despite basics being available to many. Back at home, people, including my parents, were categorically refusing to believe that starting salary of a banker could be as low as below $30k (per year) in…

The word "banker" is a homonym and you're using it in two different ways in your comment.

When people imagine bankers making a lot of money, they are talking about investment bankers. When people talk about bankers making $30k, they're talking about retail bankers.

These careers have nothing in common with each other. It's like comparing a McDonald's retail employee to a chemical engineer.

Re: An Afghan minister who became a bicycle courier in Germany

#44

Post by BoorishBears »

quonn wrote: post #26
BoorishBears wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There were two statements: - Knowing German is important - Germans are more xenophobic than they care to admit Why are you forcing them to be one then attacking that false premise?

Because these statements are logically connected in the form of an argument and even an example is giving.

You literally just confirmed my comment.

You understand that they're not saying Germans are xenophobic because they prefer a language, but that it was just a single example. That they are two separate concepts and one is just a small part of the other.

If I didn't know better I'd think you forced more of a connection than there was to build a strawman argument.

Re: An Afghan minister who became a bicycle courier in Germany

#45

Post by BoorishBears »

ausudhz wrote: post #29
BoorishBears wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My father had no trouble transferring his education into getting his PhD. My mother's skills carried her to a doctorate in nursing My uncle's medical skills carried over well enough for him to be an orthopedic surgeon My aunt's carried well enough to run her own medical clinic in Norway Do you think they're learning to count sticks or something to get their degrees in other countries? Why wouldn't thinks as internal…

It's not transferable 1:1, some college / university are not even recognized abroad. I had a friend of mine from Thailand that couldn't get recognized her master degree in marketing in an European country. So she enrolled again to go through the same stuff she learned just to get the valid degree spendable in the county

My comment is saying they're not transferable 1:1 right there...

Even between first world countries they're not transferable 1:1, even within single countries they're not transferable 1:1

But the reality is your friend had an incredible head start going over the same stuff she learned. There's this narrative that high educated people form 3rd world countries all have to end up in menial jobs because somehow a doctor/lawyer/engineer/tradesperson from a 3rd world country is not knowledgeable enough to do anything else by 1st world standards, and it's more of a meme than anything.

Re: An Afghan minister who became a bicycle courier in Germany

#46

Post by vharuck »

CryptoPunk wrote: post #38
chmod775 wrote: post #19

I order food just about every second day, with a lot of it being delivered by 'lieferando' people. This used to be mostly young people: think students and high schoolers. But lately I've been greeting mostly people looking to be 40-50 at the door. I've been getting used to it but the first few times I was surprised. I think this is the motivation behind the article: People aren't expecting anyone older than say 25 to…

>>High schoolers who get rotated out every six month won't exactly be the best at negotiating or even think of unionization efforts. Artificially raising pay above market rates leads to higher consumer prices, and massive deadweight loss from greater unrealized production/earnings. Between 1870 and 1900, when there was no minimum wage, or labor regulations to empower unions, US wages doubled in inflation-adjusted ter…

A better explanation of the growth from 1870 to 1900 is the Second Industrial Revolution[1]. This was a short period of massive changes to logistics (better railways), society (electric lights improved factory productivity), and what was even possible to make (improved materials and precision machining). Labor only comes into the story because less labor was needed to make things. Wages went up because productivity shot up.

I would be more convinced if you showed two similar nations who had very different outcomes during the 1870s to 1900s because of wages.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Industrial_Revolution

Re: An Afghan minister who became a bicycle courier in Germany

#47

Post by ben_w »

AdrianB1 wrote: post #32
quonn wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you please describe the situation? Are you saying someone asked a question in English and got a reply in German? Or are you saying there was an office with 20 German-speaking employees and one English speaking one and then much of the informal talk was in German? It‘s true, it‘s like that. And that‘s not xenophobic. It may be impolite, depending on the situation. It‘s not specific to Germany as anyone working in…

Simplest example: my first time in Munich I was struggling with the subway instructions, they were all in German and this was before Internet on smartphones and Google translate, so at the entrance of the station I asked several people in English if they speak English and can tell me what ticket to purchase (the different ticket by area concept was completely foreign to me). A couple said yes, I asked the question "w…

I’ve never had the problems you’re describing. I do know the first impressions are powerful (first impressions are why I don’t care much for Köln), but despite the xenophobic graffiti I’ve seen in Nürnberg and Bad Kissingen, despite the anecdotes I’ve heard from a Pakistani coworker, the closest my experiences get to “your German is no good so I will judge you” have been one rail official giving me a useless answer (and even then it wasn’t bad), and one business (legitimately) deciding I couldn’t manage one of their teams (not xenophobic! I agreed with them!), and I’ve cycled the Rhine from the Netherlands to Switzerland and visited Frankfurt (both of them), Köln, Hannover, Leipzig, Nürnberg, Suhl, Magdeburg, Heidelberg, and live in Berlin, an even despite living in Berlin my German language skills are still embarrassing.

Re: An Afghan minister who became a bicycle courier in Germany

#48

Post by quonn »

oaiey wrote: post #41
AdrianB1 wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Simplest example: my first time in Munich I was struggling with the subway instructions, they were all in German and this was before Internet on smartphones and Google translate, so at the entrance of the station I asked several people in English if they speak English and can tell me what ticket to purchase (the different ticket by area concept was completely foreign to me). A couple said yes, I asked the question "w…

Well, considering the fare system in Munich your outsourced a shitty job to them :) Aside of that: it is rude and I polite but not xenophobic. They can rightfully expect that you speak the language of the country you are in.

It has recently been reformed and is now better. :)

Re: An Afghan minister who became a bicycle courier in Germany

#49

Post by quonn »

BoorishBears wrote: post #44
quonn wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because these statements are logically connected in the form of an argument and even an example is giving.

You literally just confirmed my comment. You understand that they're not saying Germans are xenophobic because they prefer a language, but that it was just a single example. That they are two separate concepts and one is just a small part of the other. If I didn't know better I'd think you forced more of a connection than there was to build a strawman argument.

It‘s perfectly normal to use words like „and“ and still make an argument. This is done all the time in articles, it‘s not math but language. There was an assertion, then another assertion and then an example related (but not equal) to the first assertion. Sandwiching things like that can at best be called misleading, but I stand by my understanding which is that a connection between language and xenophobia was made. Other replies by the same person inside this thread confirm this as well („Germans that know English refusing to speak to people that only know English and Pashto is xenophobic.“) So he made a connection between language and xenophobia. Can we agree on this basic fact?

Re: An Afghan minister who became a bicycle courier in Germany

#50

Post by baybal2 »

vostok wrote: post #43
baybal2 wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In fact, that's more than the prime majority of bankers will ever see. Computer science/coding seemed to have travelled the same trajectory before the stigma faded. A very in demand trade that nobody really wanted to do despite basics being available to many. Back at home, people, including my parents, were categorically refusing to believe that starting salary of a banker could be as low as below $30k (per year) in…

The word "banker" is a homonym and you're using it in two different ways in your comment. When people imagine bankers making a lot of money, they are talking about investment bankers. When people talk about bankers making $30k, they're talking about retail bankers. These careers have nothing in common with each other. It's like comparing a McDonald's retail employee to a chemical engineer.

Believe me, I had no shortage of classmates who ended up starting careers in "boutique investment funds" paying not much better.
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