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Immunity Generated from Covid-19 Vaccines Differs from an Infection

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Re: Immunity Generated from Covid-19 Vaccines Differs from an Infection

#101

Post by nradov »

staticassertion wrote: post #97
nradov wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That really depends on which vaccine. There are several inactivated virus vaccines such as Sinovac used in other countries which we would expect to produce antibodies for more than just the spike protein. However it's unclear whether those vaccines are more or less effective in practice.

Are there such vaccines available in the US? It seems like those would make for effective boosters.

There are no inactivated virus vaccines authorized in the US. I'm not aware of any research on the effectiveness of using such vaccines as boosters after other types of vaccines.

Re: Immunity Generated from Covid-19 Vaccines Differs from an Infection

#103

Post by bsder »

bananabiscuit wrote: post #3

The spike protein targeting antibodies produced by the vaccine do indeed target a wider range of spike mutations than the spike protein antibodies from previous infection. However, vaccines only target spike protein, while a previous infection will cause your body to produce antibodies for a much larger set of targets on the virus, which in practice leads to a more robust immunity. This is supported by data from Isra…

> while a previous infection will cause your body to produce antibodies for a much larger set of targets on the virus, which in practice leads to a more robust immunity.

That is simply not a statement you can make without supporting evidence.

Your immune systems binds to irrelevant targets all the time. People normally got measles once, but lots of people got it multiple times.

It is entirely possible that your immune system will bind to something that mutates rapidly and have worse response than the vaccine.

As someone who got the Covid19 in Original Flavor(tm), I still went and got the vaccine. I don't want to be one of the unlucky ones whose immune system didn't flag the spike protein for destruction.

Re: Immunity Generated from Covid-19 Vaccines Differs from an Infection

#104

Post by faeyanpiraat »

brainbrane wrote: post #54

I just learned last week that my COVID antibody count from the vaccine is zero. Since I'm on an immunosuppressing medication that wipes out the B cells in my bloodstream, this isn't really all that surprising to me. I learned about this because I'm in a medical study, and other people in the study who take the same medication also don't produce any COVID antibodies in response to the vaccine. What's interesting is th…

Which medication are you using?

Re: Immunity Generated from Covid-19 Vaccines Differs from an Infection

#106

Post by faeyanpiraat »

nightfly wrote: post #69
arisAlexis wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And then the question is, should you as a vaccinated healthy person mind getting infected in the sense that it can shield you maybe even more from future variants or is this a dangerous game to play?

I think it's all about timing. Right now in Oregon our hospitals are full. So the less people getting infected right now the better.

If I remember correctly, the number of vaccinated people who get infected and require hospitalization is quite low.

Re: Immunity Generated from Covid-19 Vaccines Differs from an Infection

#107

Post by faeyanpiraat »

randomopining wrote: post #95
arisAlexis wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And then the question is, should you as a vaccinated healthy person mind getting infected in the sense that it can shield you maybe even more from future variants or is this a dangerous game to play?

That's what I've been proposing for a few months. Get the vaccine and then get the delta variant a few weeks later to crush it and then be super immune for future variants that jet off of that one.

Do you have evidence that this is the best course of action?

Re: Immunity Generated from Covid-19 Vaccines Differs from an Infection

#108

Post by jiocrag »

bobbytit wrote: post #99

This more recent Thai study shows that natural immunity is far superior for all known variants... https://www.news-medical.net/news/20210719/Thai-study-looks-...

CoronaVac vaccine? This is a much less effective vaccine than Pfizer and Moderna (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CoronaVac), so it's not surprising that natural immunity would be superior.

Re: Immunity Generated from Covid-19 Vaccines Differs from an Infection

#109

Post by [deleted] »

incrudible wrote: post #85
munk-a wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know - I consider getting vaccinated to be a matter of common courtesy to those you're going to be interacting with now. I don't feel like thanking folks for only kicking - and not murdering - the adorable puppy at this point. Those who have been advised not to get vaccinated due to immune issues or other medical reasons I completely get - but everyone else is basically saying "I think preserving my pride by…

The first principle for vaccines to be administered ethically is that the benefit must be outweigh the risk. As trials have not completed and more information on vaccine side-effects is yet to be accumulated, this risk/benefit can be assessed only speculatively. For instance, this[1] study suggests that the risk of Myocarditis from COVID in young men is six times higher from an infection than from a vaccination. If w…

[deleted]

Re: Immunity Generated from Covid-19 Vaccines Differs from an Infection

#110

Post by bananabiscuit »

tylerhou wrote: post #83
bananabiscuit wrote: post #3

The spike protein targeting antibodies produced by the vaccine do indeed target a wider range of spike mutations than the spike protein antibodies from previous infection. However, vaccines only target spike protein, while a previous infection will cause your body to produce antibodies for a much larger set of targets on the virus, which in practice leads to a more robust immunity. This is supported by data from Isra…

As other commentators have noted, it's quite a leap in logic to use reinfection data to make a mechanistic claim on how natural infection may or may not improve the immune response compared to vaccination. In addition, the naturally-infected and vaccine populations are not the same. For example, having a bad experience with a natural infection of Covid may cause people to not participate as much in virus-risky behavi…

That mechanism of action is just what I’ve seen put forth by immunologists commenting on the these kinds of results.

While the author’s opinions on the necessity of vaccines do differ, they do agree on my main point: that empirically, natural immunity is indeed robust and tentatively even better than vaccine acquired immunity.

It looks like getting a vaccine helps boost immunity in all cases, whether you had a previous infection or if you had 2 doses and I would bet even after the booster, each additional shot will continue to provide some marginal benefit. So keep getting jabs, I guess, or you’re killing grandma.

I think at this point throwing in “you should vaccinate (regardless of your individual circumstance)” into your conclusion, even if it’s a complete non-sequitor, is a hedge against losing your job/funding/respect of your equally frightened peers. The COVID research equivalent of the “making the world a better place” SV trope.

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