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The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

theatlantic.com

691–700 of 1001 posts

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#691
That this article is even necessary proves that our leadership in the west has utterly failed to convey the goal of Coronavirus suppression tactics. Either that, or the sensible message is being morphed, funhouse mirror style, even through the most banal of media outlets.

COVID-19 in some form was always going to be around forever. The goal was never complete eradication. Perhaps the miracle of the mRNA vaccine led us to fantasize, a little too openly, about going back to the pre-pandemic status quo. But that was never going to be the case.

Personally, I’ve already moved on. I’ll wear a mask as the situation dictates. I’ll get the boosters. I’ll keep mailing in my nasal tests twice a week and check the results. I’ll keep an eye on the hospital numbers and modify my risky behavior as needed. I won’t argue with people about the mask, about vaccines, about the origins. I’ll work from home as long as they’ll let me and go into the office when they say I’ve got to — or I’ll find another job.

I’ve already made peace with this thing. I’ve moved on. If I get it, I get it — but there’s no real use in obsessing over it any longer. I’ve adapted, and I’m ok with that.

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#692

Good article, but doesn't mention the other reason that covid-19 is never going completely away: animal reservoirs. We know that dogs, cats, hamsters, guinea pigs, mink, white-tailed deer, a gorilla, and a tiger have been found to have been infected with covid-19. It is implausible that it will ever cease to have an animal reservoir, especially given the finding in Canada of 30% of white-tailed deer having it. Of dis…

> We know that dogs, cats, hamsters, guinea pigs, mink, white-tailed deer, a gorilla, and a tiger have been found to have been infected with covid-19.

How do we know this? PCR test? At what threshold? Or, antigen test? Is there a guinea pig antigen test for COVID?

I'm suspicious of this reasoning due to the apparently complicated and necessary natural pathway this virus used to become infectious to humans in the first place. This apparently doesn't apply anymore?

> Of diseases that get as widespread as this, with animal reservoirs

The contact with those reservoirs needed to be much more than casual in order for infections to pass. I'm not sure this logic applies to a SARS virus.

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#693

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Turning vaccines into a political wedge issue is one of the stupidest things I've seen in my life. Something tells me that this is just history repeating. The difference here is the same as your metaphor; the world is a village and now its much easier to see that one conspiracy nut every village has that gets outcasted. The problem of course is that now those nuts can band together in the thousands thanks to worldw…

The SARS-CoV-2 vaccines are a "political wedge issue" not because of the "conspiracy nut in every village", but because the scientific literacy of the general public is astonishingly low, and the second and third order consequences of public health policy are tremendously complex. We must encourage discussions that move beyond overly-simplistic dualistic framing such as "vax versus anti-vax", "individual choice versu…

Also, the question of should a government force its citizens to have a medical procedure. Or de-facto forcing by requiring proof for common daily activities.

This issue was then weaponized for political purposes, and people got militant about it.

But governments have consistently lied/been wrong about this virus, so there is no trust either in their messaging about this crisis.

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#694

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe "mask requirements" are a sign of society advancing? There was a time in human history when we didn't bathe regularly, or brush our teeth, or have sewage removal systems in cities, etc. Maybe the next step is "you know, breathing in particles that came from the other 600 people in this railcar is not so great". I certainly don't see a reason to go maskless on public transportation in the future. And, as supply…

You're saying society should keep wearing masks everywhere literally forever? That's so insane I can't tell whether you're even serious.

Yeah. I basically agree with the article:

> The experience may also prompt people to take all respiratory viruses more seriously, leading to lasting changes in mask wearing and ventilation.

I don't think that mask mandates will continue, but I do think that many more people will choose to wear masks in situations that warrant them. In Asia, it was already pretty common before COVID-19 and even before SARS. Walk around Tokyo on any given day and you'll see people wearing masks (mostly to protect others). I think the West now has some idea why that might be a good thing.

The world has irreversibly changed. There is no getting around that.

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#695

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Or maybe the whole 'if we just lock down for two weeks, this will be over' tops the list of stupidity New Zealand had 26 deaths in over a year of the pandemic. Not 26 per 100k population. Not 26 per day. Twenty six people full stop. Because in fact "We go hard and we go early" works. Right now they are locked down (since last week) because they had one case in their community, but of course it isn't ever one case a…

They are a bunch of islands in the middle of nowhere with a population of a larger city - how is their situation applicable to any major nation in the world ?

Uhuh. Hawaii, an entire US state that is "a bunch of islands in the middle of nowhere" and yet somehow didn't eliminate the virus has far fewer people than New Zealand.

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#696

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It just boggles my mind that with modern understanding of how these things work (and we have a MUCH more complete understanding than they had during the early 1900's), we repeat this ignorant mistake.

"Masks aren't effective" "Masks are effective" "Vaccinated don't have to wear masks" "Vaccinated should wear masks" "COVID is not airborne" "COVID is airborne" "COVID came from a wet market" "COVID came from a lab" "If you caught it, you have immunity" "If you caught it, you might not have immunity" It's not difficult to understand why there is so much confusion. Our government was and has been quite inept at its mes…

Is this really so confusing to most people? I feel like it was pretty clear throughout that the first statement in most cases was: "We expect X is [not] effective based on history, but we aren't certain because this is so new" and the second statement was "Our initial research shows that we were [right / wrong]" followed sometimes by a third statement which is "As more information arrives we were right about Y and wrong about Z".

I agree with you that politicians are afraid to give it to us straight, but I attribute their hesitance not to how they expect the people to respond but how they expect media to respond. You get in a little trouble for being wishy-washy, but you get big trouble for giving a straight, honest well-informed sounding (described this way because its not like the announcers are the ones actually doing the research) detailed response and then finding out some of your details are wrong.

I have been thinking about this a lot, we all hate the way politicians speak (me included) but we made them speak this way because while they may not impress anyone they don't give definitive sound bites that will then be repeated over and over on the news when they happen to be wrong.

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#697

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Vaccine refusal has not become a major partisan political issue in any other country. It happened here because of the shameless cynicism of the Republican Party and aligned media apparatus.

You must be joking? As bad as (some) Republicans are let's not forget Biden, Harris, Schumer, etc saying they wouldn't take the "Trump Vaccine." Not only did that put distrust into the hearts of people on the left, it also gave ammunition for the people on the right. It should have never been a political issue. Unfortunately this is a bipartisan problem (though right now it's more prevalent on the right, I suspect if…

No, definitely not joking. As https://astralcodexten.substack.com/p/lockdown-effectiveness... notes, there is essentially zero correlation between any European government's policy at one time or another. They all adjusted to what was happening with COVID, no matter what other political alignments those in power had. (Yes, even Sweden.)

By contrast in the USA, and ONLY in the USA, COVID became a partisan issue so state policies didn't change much.

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#698

So work from home is going to last longer then?

I think the answer is yes.

Most of the people setting the remote work/in office policies seemed to be thinking that vaccines offered a path back to normalcy. Delta seems to have blown that idea out of the water.

It is possible that in the endemic covid world, there always remains a significant health risk due to breakthrough cases, especially for folks who are older or have comorbidities. Given that, it seems employers may face difficulty mandating people to work in person.

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#699
> It will feel strange for a while and then it will not. It will be normal.

Except for the people who, in addition to those who die year after year after year from flu, now die will die from Covid.

For them it won't feel normal at all.

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#700
At this point we almost know too much about the spread of this disease. Never in history have we tested so much for one thing. Never in history have we really worried about asymptomatic cases of anything. This is probably the first time in history that the whole world has the same scary thing as their front-page news.

It's going to be really, really hard for us to shake the mindset that thousands of covid cases === danger. I am sure there are many thousands of cases of many other diseases in my community right now that I will never know or care about.

I'm not trying to detract at all from the seriousness of the pandemic, just saying that going forward we'll have to pay a lot less attention to covid-19 if we want to have mental space for anything else.

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