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The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

theatlantic.com

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Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#371

Post by only_as_i_fall »

NationalPark wrote: post #362
Aeolun wrote: post #325

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If they’re spending the whole day in a classroom together the effect of masks is going to be minimal.

That's simply not what the research has found. Edit: Allow me to clarify - the research everyone is citing that says masking is effective in teachers and ineffective in students (the 37% number) predates both the delta variant and widespread infection in Southern states. Further, masking is understood etiologically as a prevention method and has been used successfully in other outbreaks and in other countries. Clinic…

Can you provide a source?

My understanding was that masks were primarily effective at preventing high viral load droplets from spreading the virus during short interactions.

I don't have any source to prove that to be the case because data on the effectiveness of masks seems frustratingly sparse.

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#372

Post by rayiner »

adrr wrote: post #310
h3cate wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unpopular opinion but as countries get majority vaccinated they have to learn to not be as scared of it.

People aren’t scared up. Concern is around ICU usage and that elective surgery in hot areas are put on hold which include critical cancer removal surgeries. Also we have a large group of unvaccinated group which are under kids under 12. With life going back to normal, the standard diseases are back like RSV, paraflu and others. Get two at the same time and it’s a emergency room visit. Get 3 at the same time and it’s…

> It boggles my mind why there is pushback on mandating kids to wear masks in schools.

It really shouldn’t if you’re an educated person who is following what scientific authorities are saying. The science here is still uncertain, but leaning towards masks for kids in schools not being worth it. See: https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2021/08/the-science-of-maski...

> At the end of May, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention published a notable, yet mostly ignored, large-scale study of COVID transmission in American schools… Distancing, hybrid models, classroom barriers, HEPA filters, and, most notably, requiring student masking were each found to not have a statistically significant benefit. In other words, these measures could not be said to be effective.

> In the realm of science and public-health policy outside the U.S., the implications of these particular findings are not exactly controversial. Many of America’s peer nations around the world — including the U.K., Ireland, all of Scandinavia, France, the Netherlands, Switzerland, and Italy — have exempted kids, with varying age cutoffs, from wearing masks in classrooms.

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#373

Post by grumpitron »

martin_bech wrote: post #347
adrr wrote: post #310

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People aren’t scared up. Concern is around ICU usage and that elective surgery in hot areas are put on hold which include critical cancer removal surgeries. Also we have a large group of unvaccinated group which are under kids under 12. With life going back to normal, the standard diseases are back like RSV, paraflu and others. Get two at the same time and it’s a emergency room visit. Get 3 at the same time and it’s…

The masks part is easy.. it has no effect.. We have been on and off masks here in Denmark, and it seems to have no effect on spread. Also mostly you get covid when not wearing one.. from a family member or a friend..

Isn’t this a contradiction?

“Masks don’t work” and then in the next paragraph “mostly you get COVID when not wearing [a mask]”

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#374

Post by elastic_is_slow »

evnc wrote: post #277
Expirat wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That's why I don't really understand why there are still covid restrictions in countries that are close to full vaccination, like the UK Because it s not about the pandemic. It s about asserting control over population and making them obey whatever govts, ongs, big pharma or big corps come up with. A kind of a mass scale social engineering project. Edit: this btw doesn t need to be some sort of a secret group proje…

Why is this different from other instances of governments instituting laws or regulations for the sake of public safety, of which there are already many? Are seatbelt laws a mass experiment in social control? Are laws mandating wearing underwear in public "about asserting control over population and making them obey"?

> Are seatbelt laws a mass experiment in social control?

For this, or other instances you might come up with, you had a large consensus between the rulers and the ruled. No one questioned the motif behind seatbelt wearing or other public safety measures.

Do you have such a consensus for vaccine mandates, lockdowns, mask wearing or covid passports? It seems not. The only consensus you have is at the top between those who hold the power, resources and influence.

When you have skeptic voices and vaccine hesitant people among medical personnel we can t really talk about a consensus. If you can't even persuade some doctor or nurse to agree with your medical decisions without using coercion what should the average joe do? What does that tell us about the motifs of those that hold the decision power?

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#375

Post by erhk »

creamynebula wrote: post #282

Specially given that after a year and a half we still don't seem to ponder that livestock, hunting, deforestation, and all sorts of animal experimenting mean another deadly disease could slip up anytime as it just did.

Deforestation is relevant here? What are you on about

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#376

Post by pcurve »

HarryHirsch wrote: post #64
cm2187 wrote: post #16

That's why I don't really understand why there are still covid restrictions in countries that are close to full vaccination, like the UK. There isn't really a next step after having vaccinated the population, it is "steady state". So do they want us to have these restrictions (countries you can't travel to, endless testing, mask requirements) forever?

Israel has close to full vaccination, yet cases are going up because immunity is falling again and there are new variants. It's understandable why the restrictions are back again.

Yeah it's sad to see death rate spiking back up as well. https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/israel/

It's better than before, but it's too dangerous.

Maybe the only out of this is wait for more mutations with lower fatality.

:(

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#378

Post by howaboutnope »

cm2187 wrote: post #16

That's why I don't really understand why there are still covid restrictions in countries that are close to full vaccination, like the UK. There isn't really a next step after having vaccinated the population, it is "steady state". So do they want us to have these restrictions (countries you can't travel to, endless testing, mask requirements) forever?

Well, it's been profitable so far, so of course it's going to get milked for as long as possible.

https://inequality.org/great-divide/updates-billionaire-pand...

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#379

Post by mdp2021 »

qwerty456127 wrote: post #95
SamBam wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Since no one under 16 has been vaccinated yet, about 70% of the population is vaccinated (44M out of 67M). That might be barely enough for herd immunity for some diseases, but the case numbers in the UK are still very high and trending back upward, showing that this isn't enough for herd immunity for Covid. Hospitalization rates are also back up to significantly higher than they were this time last year. And that's w…

I'm almost sure 100% vaccination rate with the vaccines currently available won't change much. I hope I'm wrong. But there already are cases apparently confirming this. IMHO we should just return to normal, consider this a new kind of flu and deal with the fact it's more deadly. I always knew there is a chance a flu can kill me one day. I'm Ok with the fact the chance is higher now. My personal (apparently risky, I d…

The information up to now was a mess, but one of the early "educated opinions" was that one is more contagious in the days just before the explosion of the symptoms. So, if that holds, and if you lived an active social life and tested from time to time, you risked being a spreader.

Second, about "getting antibodies the natural way": what about a 7 points IQ drop as a risk? What about a first-level-paretian-20-per-cent risk of long consequences, "the fifth wins four fifths of the jackpot"? A few made that reasoning and could tell you it was not a good idea, some still feel damaged. I invite you: do not focus on death as a risk.

Re: The Coronavirus Is Here Forever

#380

Post by starik36 »

bingohbangoh wrote: post #179
001spartan wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Returning to normal is a terrible idea when COVID patients are overwhelming hospitals across the world. How can things be normal if our healthcare systems are nearing collapse? You might be willing to accept the risk of getting sick on your behalf, but by advocating a return to 'normal' before we have the capabilities to deal with this virus, you are advocating for putting even more stress on healthcare systems acros…

Are they really overwhelming hospitals? This keeps being repeated but most hospitals operate at about 80% capacity as-is. Places in Tennessee and Florida are currently, with COVID-19, operating at about 80%. [0] If we look at Israel, which has a very high vaccination rate, we see that they're supposedly running out of hospital space. [1] But the article linked doesn't say _anything about their actual numbers atm_ and…

> At what point does this become "zero COVID"

In New Zealand, it already has. Every time there is a single case or two, the entire locale (Auckland in this case) fully locks down. This is the 5th time it locked down. https://www.nytimes.com/2021/08/17/world/australia/new-zeala...

It's ironic that Covid has been arguably more disruptive in NZ than in US, which has a ton of cases.

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