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The Sweden experiment: how no lockdowns led to mental health, healthier economy

telegraph.co.uk

141–150 of 442 posts

Re: The Sweden experiment: how no lockdowns led to mental health, healthier economy

#141

Is it just me or there are A LOT of articles about how Sweden is better in doing X coming from the US and the UK recently? What's going on here? Frankly it seems a bit of nationalist content marketing after the 10th article I read in 3 years. Most of the times the articles claim Sweden is doing better X but that X could easily be applied to several other countries in Europe. "Sweden offers free health care and educat…

The funny thing is that the people glorifying Sweden's COVID-19 response historically reject comparisons with the country in other areas like human rights, penal policy, economic model, taxation policy etc. etc.

Re: The Sweden experiment: how no lockdowns led to mental health, healthier economy

#142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That doesn’t mean anything at all. It could just be random. This is not a serious response. The correlation is far too definite to be mere chance; and the mechanisms that cause it not hard to understand. Or in plain English: it's not random.

It’s a very serious response, and it isn’t my job to prove. All the lockdown proponents need to prove their draconian, Stone Age mitigation’s did anything at all. As far as I can see it’s just blind luck that one region “did better” than a other.

You don’t want to be forced to do anything. I get that.

Pandemic response is not coded into us, it’s something we have to consciously do- and it’s draining to fight an invisible enemy.

I have issues with authority, so I understand the desire to fight against being told what to do.

But you’re denying science, this is not helpful.

Re: The Sweden experiment: how no lockdowns led to mental health, healthier economy

#143
post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The Telegraph is essentially the mouthpiece of the British commercial property landlord classes, who have a vested interest in getting people back into the offices and shops in their portfolios. I'm curious, how does it work in reality? A boardroom meetings where landlord's representative decide what to publish in the next issue to get people into commercial property? A weekly reviews of editors where they have the…

Micromanging is not necessary. They just set the tone and don't hire people who would write anything opposed to their policy [1] which they rarely need to explicitly convey, although they do at times of course. People write things that they really like get rewarded. "Manufacturing Consent: The Political Economy of the Mass Media" by Edward S. Herman and Noam Chomsky explains how this work with a very large number of…

Exactly.

Internet commenters love to think their enemy's minions are stupid.

In reality they're just as smart as you are and don't need to be specifically told what the people in charge do and don't want published and/or what tone they should take.

Re: The Sweden experiment: how no lockdowns led to mental health, healthier economy

#144
post #128
post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Telegraph is essentially the mouthpiece of the British commercial property landlord classes, who have a vested interest in getting people back into the offices and shops in their portfolios. On an average day you'll notice multiple anti-remote working articles parroted by Cabinet ministers. Why should they care how businesses conduct their business, especially if it's more convenient and can lead to a happier and…

> The Telegraph is essentially the mouthpiece of the British commercial property landlord classes, who have a vested interest in getting people back into the offices and shops in their portfolios. I'm curious, how does it work in reality? A boardroom meetings where landlord's representative decide what to publish in the next issue to get people into commercial property? A weekly reviews of editors where they have the…

Marriage and friendship networks. Particularly those formed in the public school (“public” means paid in UK) system. I doubt it’s official meetings, but rather discussions outside work.

Re: The Sweden experiment: how no lockdowns led to mental health, healthier economy

#145
post #92
post #54

Non-Swede who lived in Sweden basically all of 2020 here. We basically self isolated most of the year and only did grocery shopping with masks and keeping distance but a lot of people really did not care about social distancing or masks. My wife and I were often very uncomfortable being out of the house and really did not like the relaxed guidelines. We commuted a lot to Denmark and the contrast was huge. We felt so…

So now that Denmark is lifting basically all measures, are you planning to move on?

Practically everyone is vaccinated now, or very soon. Most people who were in favor of social distancing measures don't want this stuff to be codified indefinitely, just because they like limiting people's lifestyles.

The intention has always been to mitigate the worst health effects of covid, which means temporary measures.

Re: The Sweden experiment: how no lockdowns led to mental health, healthier economy

#146
post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Hindsight is 20/20" because perfect eyesight is 20/20: https://www.aao.org/eye-health/tips-prevention/what-does-20-...

20/20 is actually just normal vision, not perfect eyesight.

Yes, this just means you (first number) can see at 20 feet what the normal person (second number) can see at 20 feet. I don't know why 20 feet became the standard for comparison.

Re: The Sweden experiment: how no lockdowns led to mental health, healthier economy

#147
post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The Telegraph is essentially the mouthpiece of the British commercial property landlord classes, who have a vested interest in getting people back into the offices and shops in their portfolios. I'm curious, how does it work in reality? A boardroom meetings where landlord's representative decide what to publish in the next issue to get people into commercial property? A weekly reviews of editors where they have the…

Marriage and friendship networks. Particularly those formed in the public school (“public” means paid in UK) system. I doubt it’s official meetings, but rather discussions outside work.

Yep, it’s the dinner after the committee meeting, the bar after that. The weekend adventures, etc. That’s where the politics are discovered. And then coordinated.

Re: The Sweden experiment: how no lockdowns led to mental health, healthier economy

#148
post #127

I see a lot of articles about how government reactions were good or bad for COVID. I have seen nothing regarding how a country's environment and population density affect COVID, I guess it is hard to push an agenda with that narrative. It seems the country's that "responded" the best all have low population density and/or are physically isolated from other countries. I see people praising leadership from places like…

South Korea/Taiwan don't have low population density. Best response comes from states with educated citizens with good basic hygiene and understanding of exponential so are able to accept early intervention. NZ have the benefit of citizens actually trust the government; bit of a wet dream for many politicians around the world.

It seems improbable that all the best responses were all effectively isolated island nations. I think they may have another advantage.

Re: The Sweden experiment: how no lockdowns led to mental health, healthier economy

#149

Telegraph has an anti-lockdown agenda to push in the UK; it is not an impartial source here. In the UK the praise for the "Sweden model" comes particularly from the conservative-aligned pro-business anti-lockdown lobby; who are producing PR for their proposition that "lockdowns do more (economic) harm than they do (public health) good". Right or wrong, it's certainly not impartial reporting on a foreign country, it's…

Have you ever noticed that the people who reject model-derived predictions for things like pandemic and climate are extremely confident about their economic forecasting ability? If only some of these super-geniuses would share their unquestionable brilliance with other fields, not to mention eliminating recessions and financial panics.

Why do we reject model-derived projections for the stock market and accept them for climate and disease?
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