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Apple explicitly asks employees to merge their personal and work accounts

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Re: Apple explicitly asks employees to merge their personal and work accounts

#181

Post by dheera »

Manuel_D wrote: post #18

This would be a serious breach of privacy if true. But reading the tweets I'm not sure what the policy really is: > During a discovery thing 3yr ago, legal forced me to hand-over all my texts. They refused to let me delete anything, even "fully personal," even when I said "by fully personal I mean nudes." They said they're in their "permanent evidence locker This doesn't sound like company policy, and more like they…

> legal forced me to hand-over all my texts

Who is "legal"? Corporate legal? They no right to your personal phone. Even if they were subpoenaed, they could only ask you to hand over data on corporate devices, not your personal one.

The only people who can get your personal device are a search warrant from a court.

Re: Apple explicitly asks employees to merge their personal and work accounts

#182

Post by lmm »

Cd00d wrote: post #148
shaggyfrog wrote: post #7

Create a firewall between your personal and professional time. Another name for this is “setting healthy boundaries”. Always create new accounts for anything work related -- GitHub, Apple ID, whatever. Don’t install work apps on your personal phone. Don’t enrol your personal phone in corporate MDM. If they want you to use a device for work, ask them to give you one. Don’t do personal stuff on your work devices. Don’t…

I get that in the "most secure boundary" sense, I should have a work provided phone for work stuff, BUT... I don't want to carry two phones. I'm part of a team that owns some responsibility for fixing things that break in the night. I find it freeing to be able to reply to a Slack or Outlook email while I'm with my kids at the playground. I see the above advice all the time, but I can't help but think it only relates…

If you're trying to get promoted by doing unpaid overtime and/or unpaid oncall shifts, you're a class traitor screwing over your colleagues. Help them by setting healthy boundaries even if you don't actually need them yourself.

Re: Apple explicitly asks employees to merge their personal and work accounts

#183

Post by dheera »

cortesoft wrote: post #133
res0nat0r wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only way there should be a legal hold on a phone like that, is if it is her work phone, which she shouldn't be having nude pics of herself on in the first place.

Personal devices could certainly be a part of discovery.

The company has no legal right to even know you have a personal device. You could just say you don't have one.

Or just quit the company if they ask you to hand over a personal device.

Re: Apple explicitly asks employees to merge their personal and work accounts

#184

Post by jjtheblunt »

devnull3 wrote: post #106

It seems this person has/had some major work problems at Apple. The employees there apparently kept scores (on a white board?) to make her want to quit the job [1] [1] https://twitter.com/ashleygjovik/status/1427351298920239106 No matter who is in the wrong here, this is some A-grade toxic shit. This is unacceptable even for kids let alone adults.

Do people just assume she's telling a truthful story?

I wonder that because I worked there for years and anything remotely like what she claims was implausible when I was there, and would have been immediately corrected with impunity had such occurred.

I mean there's security all over and they're not in a managerial chain, so something seems very difficult about her claims to me.

In saying that, maybe she did have some entirely crazy people around her. Evidence would be stronger than conjecture, and I hope she has some if such happened.

Re: Apple explicitly asks employees to merge their personal and work accounts

#185

Post by aaronbrethorst »

techrat wrote: post #155
Cd00d wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I get that in the "most secure boundary" sense, I should have a work provided phone for work stuff, BUT... I don't want to carry two phones. I'm part of a team that owns some responsibility for fixing things that break in the night. I find it freeing to be able to reply to a Slack or Outlook email while I'm with my kids at the playground. I see the above advice all the time, but I can't help but think it only relates…

> I don't want to carry two phones. Ah, so you're willing to trade privacy for convenience.

OK, Dave Morin.

Re: Apple explicitly asks employees to merge their personal and work accounts

#186

Post by DaiPlusPlus »

kylec wrote: post #2

Yeah, it's really weird that the @apple.com email you get when you start isn't usable as an Apple ID. I didn't want to sign into my personal account on my work computer for a BUNCH of reasons (privacy being one, but beta software messing with my data was another) so I created a new free iCloud account. But it struck me as VERY odd that Apple would want their employees minging their work and personal data on their per…

It was a similar story at Microsoft: for a long time we couldn't reliably use @microsoft.com e-mail addresses as MSAs ("Microsoft Accounts", the then-new name for Windows Live IDs), so we were all told to create a new non-@microsoft.com address for stuff that needed an MSA - I don't remember the guidance for if we could re-use our pre-existing personal addresses or not but I know that some people did, but most people created new @outlook.com addresses.

IIRC, they did iron out the problems eventually, and finally came-up with a semi-decent UX for normal (non-MSFT) people that had an Office 365 ("Organizational account") with the same e-mail address as an MSA - but I think internal MSFT accounts still have issues? My information isn't up-to-date fwiw.

FWIW, I never had access to any "real" internal resources via my new @outlook.com MSA address - the only things it did have access to was things like MSDN Subscriber Downloads[1] and as a backup/recovery e-mail address for my @ms org account.

[1]: Oddly enough, I retained access to the MSDN Subscriber Downloads area, including full ISOs and Product Keys for about 2 years after I left the company, I only lost access because that was when they moved everything over from "MSDN Subscriber Downloads" to "My Visual Studio" which changed everything.

Re: Apple explicitly asks employees to merge their personal and work accounts

#187

Post by shakezula »

xenophonf wrote: post #175
Cd00d wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I get that in the "most secure boundary" sense, I should have a work provided phone for work stuff, BUT... I don't want to carry two phones. I'm part of a team that owns some responsibility for fixing things that break in the night. I find it freeing to be able to reply to a Slack or Outlook email while I'm with my kids at the playground. I see the above advice all the time, but I can't help but think it only relates…

> I find it freeing to be able to reply to a Slack or Outlook email while I'm with my kids at the playground. You can spend as much time on work as you want, but you only get so much time with your children. OP's point is that you should guard the time you have and spend it wisely. Personally, I find carrying a second device and keeping things separate part of maintaining a healthy balance between my work and my pers…

I can attest to the importance of this legal separation. I had a personal laptop stolen that had work files on it from before my work had given me a laptop, and I had the uncomfortable responsibility of disclosing that to my boss.

I hadn't even done anything wrong but it made me hella uncomfortable thinking about my work or the cops getting their hands on my laptop. It just feels too personal.

I had to file police reports and everything, and ultimately it was never found, but I still hate the idea and sometimes think about where that laptop ended up.

Re: Apple explicitly asks employees to merge their personal and work accounts

#188

Post by icelancer »

ramraj07 wrote: post #63
pbreit wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't follow ANY of this advice and am unlikely to do so anytime soon.

Exactly. I’m not saying trust my employer or that I dont, I don’t care that much. Logging into slack on my phone doesn’t give them access to all my life. I don’t have to be a slave to the company but I don’t have to be a slave to paranoia either.

If you're ever caught up in discovery or a lawsuit, you'll realize why many of us believe in multi-device and firewall policies.

Re: Apple explicitly asks employees to merge their personal and work accounts

#189

Post by renerthr »

Spooky23 wrote: post #42
shaggyfrog wrote: post #7

Create a firewall between your personal and professional time. Another name for this is “setting healthy boundaries”. Always create new accounts for anything work related -- GitHub, Apple ID, whatever. Don’t install work apps on your personal phone. Don’t enrol your personal phone in corporate MDM. If they want you to use a device for work, ask them to give you one. Don’t do personal stuff on your work devices. Don’t…

This. +100 I used to think people were paranoid about this stuff until I ran a big email system. Most big companies have a department in compliance or counsel that reads your mail, either in response to a complaint or randomly depending on the industry. Accused of sexual harassment? Your JDate and Match emails support the idea that you’re lonely. An external entity thinks somebody embezzled money? Your late credit ca…

> Most big companies have a department in compliance or counsel that reads your mail

They read the email of your personal email account if you use it in the company-owned phone? Or they read the email of your company email account?

In other words, when you say 'This. +100', what do you mean by 'This'? The parent comment raised many points and I'm confused as to which one you're referring to.

Edit: To be clear, it's my fault because I'm new to these things and I don't understand them well.

Re: Apple explicitly asks employees to merge their personal and work accounts

#190

Post by derefr »

barsonme wrote: post #151
hoten wrote: post #138

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No. Having a separate GitHub is just a pain. GitHub provides adequate separation itself (you can add multiple emails and configure notifications accordingly)

What’s difficult about it? Personally, I like knowing that my personal GitHub credentials stay only on my personal devices and my work credentials stay only on my work devices. I never have to worry about the two mixing and any problems that might arise.

Presuming you also contribute to FOSS projects, and that you additionally use the FOSS you work on personally at work, there will come a point at which a bug you find at work will require you to fix the upstream FOSS project on your work laptop. At that point, getting the git-commit attribution correct gets annoying.
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