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Steve Jobs Sometimes Lies to You

zachholman.com

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Re: Steve Jobs Sometimes Lies to You

#81

Post by zmmmmm »

ryanisinallofus wrote: post #14

My wife: "Will you take the trash out?" Me: "Yeah, for sure. I'll take it out tonight." Tonight rolls by and the next day she tells me "You didn't take out the trash. You lied." Did I lie? Or did I have honest intentions of taking out the trash with circumstances getting in the way? Maybe I just forgot? I don't presume to know Jobs' intentions but without a history of lying during presentations I'm going to assume hi…

I agree that "lying" is incorrect. However your analogy in turn massively underplays what happened. Context matters.

A casual reply to your wife is not the same as walking out on stage in a high profile event as a CEO for a company and stating "I will take the trash out". External third parties don't depend on you taking the trash out either. Investors aren't making decisions based on you taking the trash out. Consumers aren't buying phones based on you taking the trash out. All these things matter and that's why CEOs become legally liable for things they say and commitments they publicly make.

I think on this count there would be room for a class action from consumers who feel they bought iPhones on the basis that they would be able to video chat with other phones and now find that they can't because Apple has failed to make good on a public commitment.

Re: Steve Jobs Sometimes Lies to You

#82

Post by funthree »

ryanisinallofus wrote: post #14

My wife: "Will you take the trash out?" Me: "Yeah, for sure. I'll take it out tonight." Tonight rolls by and the next day she tells me "You didn't take out the trash. You lied." Did I lie? Or did I have honest intentions of taking out the trash with circumstances getting in the way? Maybe I just forgot? I don't presume to know Jobs' intentions but without a history of lying during presentations I'm going to assume hi…

You lied. You said something that turned out to be a lie (an inaccurate or false statement) and although people have trouble hearing the word, it doesn't make it any less true. You do not fit a few of the definitions of "lie" but you fit at least one.

edit: to all the downvoters, pick up a dictionary

Re: Steve Jobs Sometimes Lies to You

#84

Post by ugh »

Steko wrote: post #67
ugh wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I view it more as a broken promise than a lie. I do, however, think that both are, morally speaking, on a similar level. Lying is worse but a broken promise isn’t all that much better.

Where does linkbaiting rate on this scale?

Linkbaiting? Harmless.

Also: I’m pretty sure that the author of this article actually believes that Jobs was lying. It’s not linkbaiting if the headline reflects the author’s beliefs.

Re: Steve Jobs Sometimes Lies to You

#85

Post by darklajid »

18pfsmt wrote: post #57
wtracy wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

None of them inter-operate. So, when you have a friend on Tango, a friend on Qik, and a friend on Skype, you have to install Tango, Qik and Skype. We don't have a single protocol for everyone to standardize on, and we don't even have enough access to the various protocols to build a Trillian-like client that supports everything.

We don't have a single protocol for everyone to standardize on, and we don't even have enough access to the various protocols to build a Trillian-like client that supports everything. I thought both XMPP and SIP were supposed to solve that problem. What happened?

XMPP won. See Facebook, GTalk. The problem is, that you can (ab)use XMPP and disable some of the open parts (federation). The protocol is still the One True IM Protocol imho, but the biggest hosters suck.

I'm less familiar with SIP, but my take here is:

SIP seems to be a good thing, but then you notice that it doesn't do thaaat much and end up in hell afterwards (Okay, we've got a session. Which (open?) codecs are we going to use now?

What I'd have loved to see is jingle taking off. Give me XMPP based voice/video. The problem? For a long time Google fucked that up. There were lots of problems because of differences between the 'standard' and the implementation on GTalk. Til today the clients don't support video or audio conferences (unless you're counting the G+ hangout feature. I wonder why it is possible there, but not elsewhere. Why can't I just video call two of my friends, G+ or not?) and they still fail to support mobile phones.

Android 2.3.4 supports audio and video, but only for a limited set of hardware, because their support is tied to a specific platform. Using a different chipset (although in a powerful phone, with all hardware capabilities and Android 2.3.4? Bad luck).

So - I'd love to see XMPP win. But for now the implementation is mediocre. There's not enough support to push it, from what I can tell.

Re: Steve Jobs Sometimes Lies to You

#86

Post by Phaaze »

garbageInnerLo wrote: post #80

The author of this blog post is a known loud-mouth, a know-it-all, yet wrong 99% of the time. There's got to be a way to block these ignorant kids and their bullshit, ignorant blog posts. They are stuck in a 12-year-old mindset, and don't know why the tech world operates like it does. Seriously... look at all of his bullshit blog postings. I'm glad he's focused on that, instead of using his stupidity to harm others.…

Why are you reading 'Hacker-Wannabe-Script-Kiddie-Failed-Businessman' News anyway?

Re: Steve Jobs Sometimes Lies to You

#87

Post by juliano_q »

zyb09 wrote: post #63
juliano_q wrote: post #30

I think Facetime is already open. You can use it on your Mac, on your iPhone, on your iPad. Looks like this is open to Steve Jobs, open to all your iOS devices. Why would you need to have another kind of device anyway?

Is this fucking Scientology, where we replace the meaning of words with their opposites?! The fact that Apple is the only provider of FaceTime software and it's only available on Mac and iOS means it's proprietary. Jobs said they're going make it an open standard. They didn't. There's no third party client, there's no FaceTime for Windows or Android.

I was being ironic.

Re: Steve Jobs Sometimes Lies to You

#88

Post by glassx »

technomancy wrote: post #71
tobylane wrote: post #65

There are plenty of (insert absolutely any apple product here)-killers that are loudly touted by the manufacturer, and any apple-hater that we have never heard of since. Do we whinge that there hasn't been more proof that the iphone/etc are best? Silence isn't incriminating, it's silence. How open is Honeycomb, or Ice Cream?

> How open is Honeycomb, or Ice Cream? Do you have any idea how much crap they are getting for that? People made a stink, and they learned their lesson.

And it's a cool thing. I hope Apple learns their lesson too, with articles like this.

My guess is that, in both cases (Honeycomb and FaceTime), it was more a problem of corporate inertia or laziness rather than evil.

Re: Steve Jobs Sometimes Lies to You

#89

Post by podperson »

ryanisinallofus wrote: post #14

My wife: "Will you take the trash out?" Me: "Yeah, for sure. I'll take it out tonight." Tonight rolls by and the next day she tells me "You didn't take out the trash. You lied." Did I lie? Or did I have honest intentions of taking out the trash with circumstances getting in the way? Maybe I just forgot? I don't presume to know Jobs' intentions but without a history of lying during presentations I'm going to assume hi…

I think it's interesting that Steve Jobs has earned this much credit with most of us (I think most). He has a history of saying stuff that is either clearly true at the time or turns out to have been surprisingly frank in hindsight.

My guess is he was shooting from the hip and then discovered that it was a much bigger pain in the ass than he realized.

Re: Steve Jobs Sometimes Lies to You

#90

Post by jsz0 »

Most people have a motive for lying. I don't really see that here. What does Apple have to gain by suggesting FaceTime would be an open standard? Did lines of people show up to buy iPhones because FaceTime would be an open standard? I doubt it. Quite the opposite I think. If you could only FaceTime between iOS devices (and Macs) that might be a competitive advantage. My guess is they simply calculated it was not worth the effort in the end. Making something an open standard and supporting centralized authentication/etc is a nontrivial thing for what purpose?
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