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YouTube suspends Rand Paul for seven days

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Re: YouTube suspends Rand Paul for seven days

#301

Post by gengelbro »

Bud wrote: post #208
corndoge wrote: post #3

> YouTube indicated that examples of the offending content in the video included the line: “Most of the masks you get over the counter don’t work. They don’t prevent infection.” > It also included the quote: “Trying to shape human behavior isn’t the same as following the actual science which tells us that cloth masks don’t work.” Regardless of what you think about YouTube's misinformation policy, I don't think this i…

This is unquestionably misinformation, and Rand Paul needs to have a permanent muzzle installed until covid is extinct. Masks DO WORK. Yes, N95s work better than cloth masks, usually, but cloth masks work very well for reducing the likelihood that a covid-positive person will transmit the virus. This isn't controversial. Rand Paul needs to stop spreading lies on purpose, and if he won't, I fully support YouTube telli…

Do you hear yourself calling for muzzles to be put on people?

Re: YouTube suspends Rand Paul for seven days

#303

Post by kenjackson »

__blockcipher__ wrote: post #266
kingTug wrote: post #235

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Probably has something to do with the 600k+ dead Americans.

Every year, ~647,000 Americans die from heart disease alone. Even if the COVID death numbers aren't over-inflated, I guarantee you that if I were to time-travel to 2019 and ask you if you think that it would be worth precipitating a global supply chain disruption, missed schooling and medical appointments for children around the globe, both first and third world, and the greatest erosion in civil liberties in Western…

600k deaths after huge mitigations. Without any mitigation’s is it 3 million in the US dead?

Re: YouTube suspends Rand Paul for seven days

#304

Post by nickthemagicman »

newacct583 wrote: post #299
__blockcipher__ wrote: post #223

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are actively spreading disinformation. SARS-2 ("covid") will never be extinct. It is completely infeasible to eradicate a highly infectious zoonotic respiratory virus w/ abundant animal reservoirs. > but cloth masks work very well for reducing the likelihood that a covid-positive person will transmit the virus You cannot possibly honestly make this statement in good faith, considering that there has only ever bee…

> You are actively spreading disinformation. SARS-2 ("covid") will never be extinct. Sigh. THIS seems to be a deliberate misreading too. Stopping the pandemic doesn't require eradicating the disease. Malaria remains endemic and largely unvaccinated, but controlled. And cloth masks are a vitally important tool in making that happen. Claiming otherwise by arguing against a strawman is... yeah, disinformation. OH MY GOD…

Do you think wearing the same mask every single day and being able to take it off when the waiter brings the breadsticks is an effective mask policy?

Would you go into surgery with a physician who wears the same mask on a daily basis?

Re: YouTube suspends Rand Paul for seven days

#305

Post by iammisc »

maxerickson wrote: post #271
roenxi wrote: post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure this tack is sufficient to defend YouTube's policy. This is quite close to arguing that a sitting senator shouldn't have opinions on what government policy is meant to be achieving. Rand Paul is (1) elected (2) holds a medical license. YouTube is suspending him because (1) he is disagreeing with government policy and (2) they don't like his medical opinion. I think it is fair to say you are defending (1)…

YouTube doesn't have any responsibility (especially legal) to the public discourse. It's weird that people have decided that privately owned companies should be required to do things they don't want to do, in the name of freedom.

> YouTube doesn't have any responsibility (especially legal) to the public discourse.

Of course it does, should the government decide it does.

Just like how the Civil Rights acts mandated that certain private businesses have responsibilities to serve certain classes of citizens equally.

Just like the federal housing law requires landlords, corporate or not, to rent out to all people.

The government is allowed to mandate whatever it wants to benefit the public (the source of its power) so long as such a mandate is not prevented by a higher law.

The courts have found that these laws are constitutional:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heart_of_Atlanta_Motel,_Inc._v...

> countered that the restrictions requiring adequate accommodation for African Americans were unquestionably related to interstate travel and that Congress, under the Constitution's Commerce Clause, certainly had the power to address such a matter in law.

Apparently, all the US government would need to do is argue that YouTube, as a multi-state corporation, is subject to interstate commerce regulations, which is very precedented.

Re: YouTube suspends Rand Paul for seven days

#306

Post by fhood »

__blockcipher__ wrote: post #270
fhood wrote: post #261

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That study was measuring masks ability to prevent being infected with the virus, not spreading it, so not directly applicable to parent's claim

I agree but the issue is no such study exists. Which is why I told them straight-up that their claim is not in good faith. Masks have never been shown to stop community transmission of respiratory viruses. In fact if we back up for a bit and look at the immunology and population dynamics involved it's not even clear that we should want to slow the spread of SARS-2 or other respiratory viruses in the general populatio…

We are fighting against quicksand, but virtually anything that slows transmission makes it easier to stay afloat. And letting it run its course is going to kill a lot of people, and the measures that were put in place almost certainly saved a lot of lives. I personally think that anything that might reasonably be used to slow transmission should be used, if for no other reason that to make sure that hospitals can keep up, and that vaccination rates can reach a point where new variants are a minor annoyance rather than a massive health crisis.

Re: YouTube suspends Rand Paul for seven days

#307

Post by jl2718 »

convery wrote: post #247
IIAOPSW wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is misinformation. Masks (cloth or otherwise) were meant to reduce infectiousness, not completely prevent the possibility of infection. Masks (cloth or otherwise) do in fact reduce infectiousness. The misinformation is the implication that masks are pointless because you can still get infected. The point of masks is to get the probability of spreading it down by some multiple, not to be a personal not-my-problem-a…

His comment was on masks reducing the risk of you getting infected, not infecting others. Which is a selfish point, but nonetheless a correct one.

But it should have been explicit in the reasoning for wearing masks in the first place. It seems to me that the pro-mask people have such contempt for the masses that they must disguise a reasonable social request into a selfish mandate, which is just weird. And yes, there are those who are unreasonably selfish, but I don’t think it’s working on them anyway. My personal take on this is that the mask issue is a poor choice for a hill to die on. It has to be the most reasonable and innocuous of all the unprecedented powers in exercise.

Re: YouTube suspends Rand Paul for seven days

#308

Post by rwcarlsen »

idonotknowwhy wrote: post #277
whiddershins wrote: post #212

What's really funny is nobody knows if cloth masks work, but lots of people are commenting here as if this is the debate. The best I can steelman YouTube's position would be: "Yes we need free speech in order to debate all the things and get ever closer to truth. YouTube does not want to host this debate. Please find an alternate venue, and if the consensus changes, we will dutifully update our policies to reflect th…

Any mask works because it reminds you not to touch your face

Anecdotally, I frequently observe masks causing people to touch their faces more. Masks cause itches, need to be adjusted, must be removed for drinking/eating, etc. I would be very interested in large-scale empirical studies measuring how effective masks are in practice. Sure in theory they can help. But I suspect in practice with the general public in everyday life, they do little to nothing to reduce virus sharing.

Re: YouTube suspends Rand Paul for seven days

#309

Post by nicetryguy »

Anti-mask sentiment on HN is shocking and disappointing. They save lives. Should seatbelts be a personal choice too? Do they infringe on your "liberty"? If you want data, look at the recent case numbers of all of the southern states fighting the masks tooth and nail.

EDIT: Flagged? ...really? Highly disappointing.

Re: YouTube suspends Rand Paul for seven days

#310

Post by notimetorelax »

mrfusion wrote: post #280

Not one time in history have the people shutting down conversation and debate been on the right side of history. Ever. If you're right you don't fear opposing ideas.

I think it may be a false statement. History is written by the victors - we may not know what debates were successfully shut down by the winning party.
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