Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Climate change: IPCC report is 'code red for humanity'

bbc.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

401–410 of 1001 posts

Re: Climate change: IPCC report is 'code red for humanity'

#401

Post by pessimizer »

helsinkiandrew wrote: post #23

> Climate change: IPCC report is 'code red for humanity' What almost alarms me more than the thought of a climate apocalypse is that I don't think this (a UN report) is going to have any effect on the opinions of 40% of the public who see climate change as some kind of job destroying conspiracy. Nothing short of Florida disappearing under the sea is going to make any difference, perhaps we (as a species) don't deserv…

> Nothing short of Florida disappearing under the sea is going to make any difference

That won't make a difference; Liberals will blame the Floridians themselves for being conservative, and Conservatives will say it was an inevitable part of God's Plan, that saying it shouldn't have happened is a criticism of His Judgment, and that saying that it was caused by humans is claiming the type of power that only belongs to God.

Re: Climate change: IPCC report is 'code red for humanity'

#402

Post by shadowfaxRodeo »

carrolldunham wrote: post #367
shadowfaxRodeo wrote: post #276

The internet causes around 5% of global carbon emmissions. It's invisible, and difficult to measure, so little gets done about it. But if you're a developer who wants to help. Check out: https://sustainablewebdesign.org/ Pretty much all the solutions to making a greener web would make the web better in general. - Send less data (efficient video, images, fonts, etc) - Make fewer requests - Use a CDN (the greenest one…

>*Stop collecting vast amounts of personal data* This is why I left and denounce green movements. It's always (on an individual activist up to organization level), a front for completely unrelated ideological agendas. Edit: 'A front' is too strong - a convenient vector. But you poison the well by failing to restrain yourself from slipping that stuff in.

Most of the activists I know are not developers, they don't have tech savvy people in their groups. And as far as I can tell developers will just add a million tracking scripts to anything without much thought.

I don't think this makes green movements fake. it just means that they don't understand security and privacy.

I couldn't even join my local group during lockdown because they only opperate on facebook.

Re: Climate change: IPCC report is 'code red for humanity'

#403

Post by imranhou »

zthrowaway wrote: post #269
oliwarner wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think we all have a fairly good idea of some things that would help, it's the scale we struggle to comprehend. But even if you could find out the magic threshold for what it would take , if there's anything that lockdown and covid restrictions in the UK have taught me in the past 18 months, it's that we all need to follow the rules or it's pointless. It's so disheartening to see others not pay these taxes, to not r…

The attempt to force people into limiting their lives for CO2 concerns falls into environmental authoritarianism. That’s why. Lots of people see it that way and when you mix hyperbolic environmentalist doomsday predictions that never actually happen people stop taking this seriously. Additionally, the US is built on the foundation of personal freedom and autonomy. We would be the last country where people would willi…

If the pandemic has taught us anything, it is to be wary of problems slipped under the rug. The climate change issue is backed by hard evidence, and the eventual result of the current situation if unchanged is dire.

If we wait to act until the eventual result is in our face, then we are no different than animals that try to outrun a flood, if so then what is the purpose being self aware? Freedom eh?

Re: Climate change: IPCC report is 'code red for humanity'

#404

Post by AnIdiotOnTheNet »

Mikeb85 wrote: post #386
belorn wrote: post #346

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There were a study done in Sweden a few years ago that looked at the question about an individuals actions and the corresponding CO2 production. No car > skipping flight > buy green energy > Get a electric car > diet. https://www.lunduniversity.lu.se/article/four-lifestyle-choi...

Of course the biggest emitters are industrial. Anything we attribute to individuals pales in comparison to the transport industry, production of goods like steel and concrete, resource extraction, power generation and production of consumer goods. Telling consumers to cut back on X is essentially passing the back and making consumers feel bad without actually addressing the bulk of emissions.

Yes, but those things do not exist in a vacuum, they are produced based on demand. If we care so much about our own convenience that we are unwilling to change the things we can on an individual level, how will we ever be willing to sacrifice things as a society? Are you going to give up your 2-day prime delivery because we no longer ship things by truck? Or a wide variety of items at your grocery because we stop gathering food from the four corners of the earth?

Re: Climate change: IPCC report is 'code red for humanity'

#405

Post by simion314 »

Mikeb85 wrote: post #386
belorn wrote: post #346

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There were a study done in Sweden a few years ago that looked at the question about an individuals actions and the corresponding CO2 production. No car > skipping flight > buy green energy > Get a electric car > diet. https://www.lunduniversity.lu.se/article/four-lifestyle-choi...

Of course the biggest emitters are industrial. Anything we attribute to individuals pales in comparison to the transport industry, production of goods like steel and concrete, resource extraction, power generation and production of consumer goods. Telling consumers to cut back on X is essentially passing the back and making consumers feel bad without actually addressing the bulk of emissions.

>Of course the biggest emitters are industrial.

Can industry exists without consumers? If you don't buy any cars then you have an impact. If you don't buy a new laptop/phone each year you have an impact on electronic industry. If you don't order online a 1$ gadget daily you have an effect.

Re: Climate change: IPCC report is 'code red for humanity'

#406

Post by qayxc »

jokoon wrote: post #329

I'm still very skeptical how the measures will take into effect if they ever happen. In france the yellow vests protest was caused by a planned carbon tax increase on gas. Car dependent citizens rioted. A carbon tax will reduce the living standard of everyone, and it will take time for society to readjust. I really think the economy will tank and take a lot of time to adjust to a green economy, as it's not only elect…

> Road transport is only 12% of co2 emissions.

This is flawed reasoning. The figure only applies to the _continuous_ CO2 emissions of road traffic. It's ignoring the CO2 emissions caused by building the vehicles, building and maintaining infrastructure and the consequences of car-centric urban planning (urban sprawl, unliveable city centres, wasted space for parking, lots of sealed ground, traffic problems, poor air quality, etc.).

This kind of reasoning also is the cause that nothing will change in the near future, because no one has the courage to price goods and services according to their true impact. A car on the road is more than just a CO2 emitter - it has to be built, scrapped, requires roads, causes traffic problems, reduces air quality, causes health issues from noise and pollutants, generates micro-particles (from tyres), seals ground (parking spaces), reduces the efficiency and liveability of cities and so on.

Debates about climate and environment need to stop focussing on CO2 emissions and start taking into account the broader impact. That's why EVs are nothing but greenwashing. That's why car traffic as a whole has to be reduced dramatically. Emissions only tell a very small part of the story (here: 12%).

Re: Climate change: IPCC report is 'code red for humanity'

#407

Post by AnIdiotOnTheNet »

aivisol wrote: post #379
belorn wrote: post #346

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There were a study done in Sweden a few years ago that looked at the question about an individuals actions and the corresponding CO2 production. No car > skipping flight > buy green energy > Get a electric car > diet. https://www.lunduniversity.lu.se/article/four-lifestyle-choi...

The highest bar in the chart says "have one fewer child". It actually exceeds any others by extremely large margin [0]. How is that even considered as the option? One child less means halving population after every generation. Eliminate the population and problem solved? [0] https://www.lunduniversity.lu.se/drimage/1120/630/4832/fourc...

You can't fault the logic, fewer people means less demand for the things that create the carbon emissions in the first place.

Re: Climate change: IPCC report is 'code red for humanity'

#408

Post by sethammons »

bamboozled wrote: post #387
MildlySerious wrote: post #296

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's a small parametric projection you can adjust to get a rough idea[1]. The conclusion is that we need to work on all ends, starting with heavy carbon taxing. We have pretty much squandered the time for anything but a drastic 180 degree turn. The best thing you can do as an individual is to be vocal about those concerns and put pressure on your political representatives to take action, CCL[2] being one example of…

I love how corporations can pollute the absolute shit out of the atmosphere, but when it comes to me having a steak, I’m the bad guy, this is one of the biggest cons of our time. Could you imagine how much more damage cheap air travel, coal fired power generation etc has done compared to people eating food ? Do you know who eats all the beef they like ? Oil company executives.

The steak one is usually more nuanced. Not all land that raises cows can be productive for crops. I tend to buy beef that is locally sourced, which also reduces a carbon footprint.

Re: Climate change: IPCC report is 'code red for humanity'

#409

Post by cool_dude85 »

Mikeb85 wrote: post #386
belorn wrote: post #346

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There were a study done in Sweden a few years ago that looked at the question about an individuals actions and the corresponding CO2 production. No car > skipping flight > buy green energy > Get a electric car > diet. https://www.lunduniversity.lu.se/article/four-lifestyle-choi...

Of course the biggest emitters are industrial. Anything we attribute to individuals pales in comparison to the transport industry, production of goods like steel and concrete, resource extraction, power generation and production of consumer goods. Telling consumers to cut back on X is essentially passing the back and making consumers feel bad without actually addressing the bulk of emissions.

That steel and concrete builds new buildings, it doesn't get sent down to the dump to rot. This is a common refrain I hear against individual action, but those industrial emitters aren't doing it because they love how CO2 smells. They are producing consumer goods or in a supply chain to produce consumer goods.

Re: Climate change: IPCC report is 'code red for humanity'

#410

Post by database_lost »

I still don't see how our individual actions can have a widespread impact regarding climate change, sure, it will have some effect, but I'm willing to bet it would add up to fractions in the end. Pushing political and economic leaders to take action by tackling just the top mega polluters on the other hand seems like it would have significant impact https://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.1088/1748-9326/ac13f1
Post reply on HN