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After DeepMind’s cofounder was placed on leave for bullying, Google promoted him

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Re: After DeepMind’s cofounder was placed on leave for bullying, Google promoted him

#201

Post by Tycho »

bowmessage wrote: post #182
Tycho wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I was the British intelligence services, this is exactly what I’d do. Recruit bright, middle class students from Oxford, fast track their career through the NGO sector (where results don’t matter), build up their public profile with press coverage, then deploy them to the private sector and hope that they will end up inside one of the multinationals that are more powerful and influential than most countries. I mea…

Why make them drop out? Just have them graduate as normal?

More beholden to your programme. With a degree from Oxford, world is your oyster. Earlier also means younger and easier to mould.

Re: After DeepMind’s cofounder was placed on leave for bullying, Google promoted him

#202

Post by digislave »

edgyquant wrote: post #127
truetraveller wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's absolutely fine for an exec to ask an employee to do "x" task, where there is value for the company, even if it is not in the employee's scope. This is a moot point, and I'm astonished we're even debating this. What has the world come to? So, imagine I ask my developer or even my accountant on a one-off, rare occasion: "write me a critique of this new UX design". He replies "How dare you ask me about UX design!"…

Did you just compare asking if something looks good to having them write up an assessment of Russian political history? Yeah I’ll go ahead and ask my dog walker to write me an analysis of the potential outcomes if Britain had joined against the US during the Trent affair. If they refuse I’ll fire them and write horrible reviews about them because obviously they don’t take their job seriously /s You’ve got to be kiddi…

You are totally in your rights to fire your dog walker if they refuse to write you an essay about Russian political history.

Re: After DeepMind’s cofounder was placed on leave for bullying, Google promoted him

#204

Post by AlbertCory »

shadowgovt wrote: post #103
TeMPOraL wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Were they bad architects though? It's easy to paint bad managers as bad workers (or even bad people ) - but sometimes, they're just bad at managing. In such cases, it's better to shift them into roles they're more suited for than to fire them and hire new people for those roles - existing employees already know the company's procedures and products. Plus, it'll likely be cheaper salary-wise - in our industry, new emp…

Google is generally loathe to fire unless they absolutely have to, so this explanation tracks.

What's your evidence for that statement?

I worked there 11 1/2 years, and by the way was not fired. However, I saw many people fired. There were probably many more placed on a Performance Improvement Plan who subsequently quit rather than get fired.

Re: After DeepMind’s cofounder was placed on leave for bullying, Google promoted him

#205

Post by artursapek »

Traster wrote: post #64
gundmc wrote: post #8

I feel like this story is overblown. He was clearly a bad manager. From what I can gather, he was placed on leave after an investigation and then moved to a policy position where he does not manage anyone. Calling it a promotion is pure spin.

At my old company it was a bit of a joke, you would repeatedly see shit managers become "architect"s. Management were too cowardly to get rid of bad managers, so they were forced to promote them to get them out of their role. So managers who were shit technically constantly ended up with senior technical titles - and everyone knew why.

Serious question: why would management be too cowardly to get rid of someone being an asshole?

Re: After DeepMind’s cofounder was placed on leave for bullying, Google promoted him

#206

Post by sjg007 »

truetraveller wrote: post #158
mLuby wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> screaming by a very senior exec is common place and cannot be called abusive It is possible that what's been acceptable for a long time is no longer okay. At the very least, I'd say tantrum are unprofessional; After all, if the exec is losing their shit over something minor, how can I trust them to keep a level head if things really get challenging? But maybe some people respond better to the stick than to the carr…

I'm against screaming. But doing someone once or twice in year, is not the same as doing something everyday. There's no mention, at all, about how frequent his outbursts / yelling / screaming was. This is precisely the issue.

There’s no place for screaming at someone in the workplace or even in the home unless someone’s life is in danger and you’re trying to save them.

It’s low EQ.

Re: After DeepMind’s cofounder was placed on leave for bullying, Google promoted him

#207

Post by meowface »

omarhaneef wrote: post #106

Here is an observation, make of it what you will: These are the environments I’ve been in where it has been very common for people to scream at each other, both loudly and often: - banking - venture - consulting These are the environments where I have not seen this behavior: - academia - tech - an operating company I’ll tell you what makes it tolerable and normal versus abusive: if a subordinate is “allowed” to yell…

Maybe I'm just sheltered, but I've never worked at a company where I've been screamed at or have heard anyone screaming at anyone. (I have heard stories, but the stories circulated because everyone recognized how atypical, absurd, and unprofessional the behavior was.)

Surely this is the norm, and screaming is the outlier?

Re: After DeepMind’s cofounder was placed on leave for bullying, Google promoted him

#208

Post by Talanes »

jay_kyburz wrote: post #175
MisterBastahrd wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, you don't. Not when you literally have business units IN that country.

Yeah but, red tape. When you ask a business unit to do it, it becomes a whole big thing. When you ask somebody on your team to do it, it might not be as good, but it gets done.

Only if you don't actually care what "done" means. Anyone can make an omelette if you're willing to define an omelette as "literally any eggs cooked in a pan." But I'd rather just ask someone who actually knows how to make an omelette.

Re: After DeepMind’s cofounder was placed on leave for bullying, Google promoted him

#209

Post by GoodJokes »

bradlys wrote: post #104
chrisseaton wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Were these peopled hired for responsibilities including historical briefings? No? So why are they being asked to do them?

End of the day, it's a job. Requirements change. You have to do things you don't want to do that might not even seem related. If you don't want to work under someone who does that stuff then leave. I yelled at a CEO because he asked me to do something that wasn't related to software engineering role. He stopped asking me and anyone else in eng due to that confrontation. But - guess what - he wanted to fired every sin…

Yes, you have described the prisoner’s dilemna. Instead of criticizing the prisoner perhaps try criticizing the those putting people in prison. Telling people to suck it up is insulting and shows that you DON’t care.

Re: After DeepMind’s cofounder was placed on leave for bullying, Google promoted him

#210

Post by qeternity »

password321 wrote: post #191
nicoburns wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quite a lot of people drop out of Oxford because it's an intense high-pressure environment. It may not have been out of choice, even if he's portraying it that way

This comment managed to blow my mind. Are we really trying to say the cofounder of DEEPMIND is too stupid / incompetent to have graduated from Oxford and came up with a charity as a front for it?

He was a childhood friend of Demis. The cofounder title seems to be less profound here.
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