Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Woman sues L.A. after being struck by car on a street where tents block sidewalk

latimes.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

391–400 of 404 posts

Re: Woman sues L.A. after being struck by car on a street where tents block sidewalk

#391

Post by emodendroket »

xnyan wrote: post #385
emodendroket wrote: post #354

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People are too shy to say it but I think a lot of them would prefer a much more violent solution to the problem. I mean, what other answer could there even be, if you don't like the status quo and also don't think homeless people should be offered housing? That's the dark secret behind a lot of these debates where people's positions otherwise seem nonsensical, I think.

Agree. A related dark position that a not-insignificant number of people hold is that it's actually necessary and perhaps beneficial to have a visible homeless class living in unnecessarily cruel conditions as a means of coercion to keep working no matter how terrible your job is. I suppose it makes sense from a certain perspective, but I think the lack of a safety net is a costly economic mistake. Take bankruptcy as…

The technical term for the phenomenon you've identified is the "reserve army of labor."

Re: Woman sues L.A. after being struck by car on a street where tents block sidewalk

#392

Post by nybble41 »

slg wrote: post #344
nybble41 wrote: post #340

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> No one is saying these need to be city owned properties. … Regulation can but restrictions on developers and force them to build affordable housing that would still be profitable just not the absolutely most profitable option. That's just the city seizing developers' property for public use without compensation. Buying the property would give the city moral authority to decide how it's used, while also accurately t…

>That's just the city seizing developers' property for public use without compensation. How is it seizing property? It is just putting in restrictions that reduce the possible profit. It is no different than thousands of other regulations. Is forcing a developer to put fire sprinklers in buildings "seizing property"? >Then maybe we need to consider that not everyone needs to live (or work) in Los Angeles. If your LA…

Regulations always amount to a seizure of property to some extend; the degree depends on how much the value of the property is reduced by the regulations. Ownership of property consists of the right to decide how that property is used. If the city is telling developers how their property is to be used then the city is exercising rights which belong to the property owner—acting as if they were the property owner.

Put another way: If the city tells developers that 10% of their land must be reserved for low-income housing, this is functionally equivalent to the city outright claiming 10% of the developers' land, turning it into low-income housing, and "compensating" the developers with the lower revenues from the rents on the low-income housing rather than the much higher rents which they would have received if the land had been developed normally. There is some compensation, yes, but not just compensation based on the value of the land. The difference is externalized onto the developers, and indirectly onto everyone purchasing or renting property, including (especially) those just above the cutoff to qualify for the low-income housing. The regulation thus amounts to a highly regressive property tax.

> Who is supposed to do the less desirable jobs in LA if no one doing those jobs can afford to live there?

Either these less-desirable jobs start paying more or they don't get done. If they're actually needed then they will pay enough to ensure that those doing them can afford to live nearby, independent of any minimum wage.

Re: Woman sues L.A. after being struck by car on a street where tents block sidewalk

#393

Post by hintymad »

hattori31 wrote: post #372
hintymad wrote: post #352

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wonder how Japan could manage their cities so well, even though they also have their own share of homeless people. As for the US, I think the US people brought the problem upon themselves, at least in some degree: it's increasingly rare to see serious discussions on pros and cons of different solutions. Instead, it's all about politics. The moment someone wants to discuss a solution, somewhere some activist or poli…

Resident of Tokyo for years here. The homeless here make some money from picking up trash and selling to the municipalities so noone begs. Also Tokyo is super safe, so they can sleep wherever without worrying. Also you have to count the fact that housing is insanely cheap in places like Tama (although very far from city center) But lately I have noticed an increase in homeless people, maybe its just Coronavirus? At a…

A big difference I noticed in Japan was that the streets that have clusters of homeless are super clean, and people were not violent. It's not like in SF, for instance, where people littered on streets and assaulted pedestrians.

Re: Woman sues L.A. after being struck by car on a street where tents block sidewalk

#394

Post by ggrrhh_ta »

goshx wrote: post #67
sudosysgen wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's the incentive to get a job if you're still going to be homeless? If you stay homeless you're eventually going to get fired too.

I don't know, maybe being able to buy food is an incentive?

Not being cynical at all. Getting food to just get by is very easy in a city. There is sooo much perfectly good food being thrown away even with packaging every day everywhere that it would be difficult not find food.

Re: Woman sues L.A. after being struck by car on a street where tents block sidewalk

#395

Post by __app_dev__ »

keewee7 wrote: post #284

Why do homeless people in the US concentrate in a few big cities with good weather? In Denmark there are fewer of them and they are more spread out and you can also find them in rural areas.

Also, many cities put Homeless on a one-way bus to San Francisco and other "homeless friendly" cities.

I'm 42 and I recall Florida doing this over 20 years ago when I was in High School.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/ng-interactive/2017/dec/...

For many years I lived in Beverly Hills (near Los Angeles). They have very few homeless so it's nice but the rest of LA (Los Angeles) is a disaster right now.

It's not just cities with Good Weather though because Seattle has one of the worst homeless problems. Although I don't have any stats it feels like it's mostly just a West Coast problem as I never hear about this from the middle of America or large East Coast Cities.

Re: Woman sues L.A. after being struck by car on a street where tents block sidewalk

#396

Post by gogopuppygogo »

tigertigerbb wrote: post #7
gogopuppygogo wrote: post #2

Kevin Paffrath has some ideas for solving this. The Democratic Party seems bent on preventing him from having a fair shot.

Looking at his website: "We will immediately house the unhoused. It’s simple. No house? We will provide a roof over their head." Well, that was easy. Obviously there are homeless and there are homeless. Looking back in time, any plan that doesn't involve being mean to some of them won't work.

From his website:

“ The National Guard will be tasked with compassionately serving our homeless community during the first 60 days of Kevin Paffrath’s administration. Day 1, construction will also begin on 80, new Emergency Facilities. After 30 days, our transition to housing begins. Modern Emergency Facilities will include: mental-health facilities, detox facilities, educational facilities, canteens, and provide medical support for ALL Californian’s without housing. Then, we have to also solve the reasons that CAUSE homelessness. ”

Re: Woman sues L.A. after being struck by car on a street where tents block sidewalk

#397

Post by gogopuppygogo »

void_mint wrote: post #79
gogopuppygogo wrote: post #2

Kevin Paffrath has some ideas for solving this. The Democratic Party seems bent on preventing him from having a fair shot.

> Kevin Paffrath (born 1992, also known as Meet Kevin),[2] is an American YouTuber, landlord, and real estate broker.[3][4][5] When your #1 qualification is YouTuber, you probably ahve no businesses holding public office.

He knows how to engage people and run a profitable business.

I know, YC still has a large audience in the Bay Area. Many of those folks live (or have lived) in San Francisco. A city that has enjoyed the fruits of their successful policies regarding business. Policies that continue pushing people with jobs away while attracting homeless folks. Not to mention electing Chesa Boudin, a district attorney literally trained by a failed socialist.

California needs help from someone who isn’t a career politician/socialist IMHO.

Re: Woman sues L.A. after being struck by car on a street where tents block sidewalk

#398

Post by gogopuppygogo »

anigbrowl wrote: post #69
gogopuppygogo wrote: post #2

Kevin Paffrath has some ideas for solving this. The Democratic Party seems bent on preventing him from having a fair shot.

I downvoted because this reeks of astroturfing. The candidate in question seems not to be serious (based on the wildly impractical/implausible policy proposals) and I really wonder if this run is just a stunt to promote his youtube channel. Novelty candidates are often publicity seekers. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kevin_Paffrath I could be wrong, of course. Perhaps you'd care to explain how you see his National Gu…

Biden is sending a “task force” into Chicago to curb crime: https://www.foxnews.com/us/biden-chicago-violence-strike-for...

Why can’t the governor send in the national guard to build housing for the needy?

Re: Woman sues L.A. after being struck by car on a street where tents block sidewalk

#399

Post by koheripbal »

watertom wrote: post #329

A lot of people who are homeless have mental health issues and are homeless due to those issues, it's almost like they need to be cared for in a mental health environment because being homeless isn't actually their problem. A lot of people who are homeless have substance abuse issues, and are homeless due the those issues, it's almost like they need to be cared for in a substance abuse program because being homeless…

The programs you suggest should treat these individuals DO exist. Typically the people afflicted with addiction and/or mental health issues refuse treatment.

I have seen well intentioned social workers walking through these tents cities trying to bring people in for treatment. They do not want to go.

Should we force people into facilities they cannot leave so that they can be treated?

It is a similar story for homeless shelters. The issue isn't the availability of beds - it is that the homeless do not want to stay in the shelter.

Re: Woman sues L.A. after being struck by car on a street where tents block sidewalk

#400

Post by rezendi »

spiderice wrote: post #251
rezendi wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is wildly incorrect. As of Dec 2019, there were 5,000 "unsheltered" / "sleeping rough" people in the UK, population ~65,000,000, according to The Economist (cite: https://www.economist.com/britain/2019/12/18/on-any-one-wint... ) which was fewer than the number in San Francisco, population ~800,000 (cite: https://hsh.sfgov.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/01/ExecutiveSu... ).

You completely changed what is being talked about. GP said nothing about "unsheltered/sleeping rough". GP said "homeless", so I'm not sure why you're suggesting that your statistics disprove what GP said. A homeless person in a shelter is still homeless. I have no idea if GP's statistics are accurate, but nothing you said proves they aren't.

? "And then I walk around the streets and see all these homeless" refers, clearly, to the homeless "living on the streets."
Post reply on HN