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Apple enabling client-side CSAM scanning on iPhone tomorrow

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Re: Apple enabling client-side CSAM scanning on iPhone tomorrow

#161

Post by ChrisKnott »

switch007 wrote: post #150
ChrisKnott wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "What is the utopian perspective of this which counterbalances the risks for this to be a path worth taking?" Basically victims of rape don't want imagery of their rape freely distributed as pornography. They consider that a violation of their rights. It's interesting how many users in this thread are instinctively siding with the offenders in this, and not the victims. Presumably because they made it through their…

> It's interesting how many users in this thread are instinctively siding with the offenders in this, and not the victims. That is infantile. Painting people advocating privacy as siding with offenders is highly insulting.

This is a situation where different people's privacy is in conflict. What's infantile is claiming sole ownership of privacy advocacy while so-whating the worst privacy violation imaginable, from the victims' perspective.

Re: Apple enabling client-side CSAM scanning on iPhone tomorrow

#162

Post by pas »

KirillPanov wrote: post #130

Could we get a more useful link here, people? CSAM? According to Google that's Confocal Scanning Acoustic Microscopy. Or something. And what with the tweeters? I think my laptop just gave me thighburns from the CPU bloat that clicking on that link caused. Eight seconds to render the page? Why do folks still use this twerker website?

CSAM = Child Sexual Abuse Material

Re: Apple enabling client-side CSAM scanning on iPhone tomorrow

#164

Post by SilverRed »

google234123 wrote: post #124
SilverRed wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I would add that people have generated legal images that match the hashes. That seems like a realistic attack. Since the hash list is public (has to be for client side scanning), you could likely set your computer to grind out a matching image hash but of some meme which you then distribute.

Might be hard if they use a huge hash.

One thing to note is these are not typical cryptographic hashes because they have to be able to find recompressed/cropped/edited versions as well. Perhaps a hash is not an accurate way to describe it.

There have been a number of cases where people have found ways to trick CV programs in to seeing something that no human would ever see. If you were sufficiently malicious I imagine it would be possible to do with this system as well.

Re: Apple enabling client-side CSAM scanning on iPhone tomorrow

#165

Post by choeger »

Sorry to say that, but stuff like this has to happen at some point when people don't own their devices. Currently, nearly no one owns their phone and at least EU legislation is underway to ensure that it stays this way. The next step will be to reduce popular services (public administration, banking, medicine) to access through such controlled devices. Then we are locked in.

And you know what? Most people deserve to be locked in and subject to automatic surveillance. They will wake up when their phone creates a China-Style social score automatically, but then it will be far too late. It's a shame for those people that fought this development for years, though. But the "I have nothing to hide" crowd deserves to wake up in a world of cyber fascism.

Re: Apple enabling client-side CSAM scanning on iPhone tomorrow

#166

Post by derefr »

Huh. I always took the cynical view and assumed that this was something every proprietary OS was already doing, and that this was part of why dark-web die-hards were so insistent on using TAILS. Guess "not yet."

On another note—OSes may only be starting to do this, but that same cynicism still leads me to presume that arbitrary closed-source third-party apps — or even closed-source binary distributions of open-source apps (e.g. the App Store versions of FOSS software) — could have been quietly scanning the files people are passing them for CSAM for years now, without telling users about it. It always seemed to me like the kind of thing it'd make sense to quietly slip into a media player like VLC.

Re: Apple enabling client-side CSAM scanning on iPhone tomorrow

#167

Post by ddtaylor »

josefx wrote: post #163
ddtaylor wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It prevents the illegal distribution of copyrighted material.

I repeat how does that keep anyone safe?

By enforcing the copyright laws that exist already to protect content creators from being counterfeited and ripped off by illegal scammers and bootleggers. Are you saying you don't agree with the concept of copyrights?

Re: Apple enabling client-side CSAM scanning on iPhone tomorrow

#168

Post by pseudalopex »

azinman2 wrote: post #149
0xy wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A reasonable person would call it a normal picture if they encountered it in isolation. Like I said, content which is not even borderline are included. By both a legal and moralistic standard they're not CSAM. Not even nearly. Of course, this is a minority of the content in the database. But even 1 such image is gross neglect of stated purpose in my book.

But are these photos that are combined in a row with other CP, and thus indicative that if you have this photo, it’s from a CP collection? Why would I have any content in my phone that would be in that database?

It's easy to imagine a collection with pictures from numerous sources. Including pictures of adults.

Re: Apple enabling client-side CSAM scanning on iPhone tomorrow

#169

Post by jimbob45 »

rinron wrote: post #118

This matches up with how I view Apples corporate thinking. "we know what's best" "the consumer is not to be trusted". Apple limits access to hardware, system settings, they block apps that don't meet moral standards, are "unsafe", or just might cause apple to not make as much money. They do not significantly care what people say they want after all they know best. A lot of people love not having options and having th…

That’s sort of the genius of Apple though, isn’t it? They make products that hold your hand tighter than any designer but their marketing department obscures that fact as much as possible with their “think different” campaigns.

It’s less “I trust Apple” and more “if I really cared, I’d have bought from another designer”.

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