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NYC to mandate proof of vaccination for many indoor settings

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Re: NYC to mandate proof of vaccination for many indoor settings

#851

Post by 99_00 »

clukic wrote: post #197

Vaccine requirements have been in place for decades. For pre-K in NYC kids need shots for PCV and Hib. For kindergarten they need more shots: Hep B, Polio, Chickenpox, and Measles, Mumps and Rubella. Going to middle school? Then you'll need more shots, the TDAP and meningococcal conjugate. These are all vaccine requirements. Is it an invasion or privacy to demand children's records? Is it the nanny state? We could go…

I'm not American, but from the American news I watch a significant % of the population doesn't have the ability to get government ID.

If they can't get that, how are they going to get vaccinated and maintain those records?

Re: NYC to mandate proof of vaccination for many indoor settings

#852

Post by ctoth »

ctoth wrote: post #849

I keep seeing an argument put forward that we should mandate getting vaccinated (and feel righteous about it!) to prevent the rise of a new scary variant that might bypass the vaccines. This argument, of course, is made by innumerate people who do not realize that the number of US holdouts is utterly dwarfed by the number of people who want a vaccine but can't get it no matter what. If we are worried about a new scar…

Thinking about this more, maybe we should literally go so far as doing a last call for vaccines. Okay, if you want them, we'll only have them for another month and then we're sending all our supply to Mexico or whatever! Far more likely to actually use them that way, and it'll get those who are holding out for no real reason to step up and get them.

Re: NYC to mandate proof of vaccination for many indoor settings

#853

Post by mcbuilder »

ctoth wrote: post #849

I keep seeing an argument put forward that we should mandate getting vaccinated (and feel righteous about it!) to prevent the rise of a new scary variant that might bypass the vaccines. This argument, of course, is made by innumerate people who do not realize that the number of US holdouts is utterly dwarfed by the number of people who want a vaccine but can't get it no matter what. If we are worried about a new scar…

Why not both? I assume your talking internationally about those that desire the vaccine, and domestically in the US for those who are reluctant. Can't we donate vaccines overseas while still pushing those who are here to get the vaccine?

Re: NYC to mandate proof of vaccination for many indoor settings

#854

Post by IG_Semmelweiss »

chadash wrote: post #373
ajsnigrutin wrote: post #341

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But a lot of them can still be positive (i think 30% with AZ vaccine), and somehow noone tests the vaccinated ones, so you'd never know, and most of them are asymptomatic, so they don't even know it. I got my vaccine early on, and haven't been tested since.

Still a lot of unknowns, but seems pretty clear that vaccinated people are less likely to contract and spread. So I like my odds better among a vaccinated crowd.

User timr was presenting a study upthread that the odds of contagion are , as of right now, basically equal between vax and no vax.

This was based on the fact the same level of virus load was found in both populations that were infected.

Re: NYC to mandate proof of vaccination for many indoor settings

#855

Post by pb7 »

ctoth wrote: post #849

I keep seeing an argument put forward that we should mandate getting vaccinated (and feel righteous about it!) to prevent the rise of a new scary variant that might bypass the vaccines. This argument, of course, is made by innumerate people who do not realize that the number of US holdouts is utterly dwarfed by the number of people who want a vaccine but can't get it no matter what. If we are worried about a new scar…

You can walk into any pharmacy and get vaccinated. We are long past demand exceeding supply. That's why vaccination rate graphs are plateauing and the numbers for 1-shot and fully vaccinated are converging.

Re: NYC to mandate proof of vaccination for many indoor settings

#856

Post by mapme »

saxman001 wrote: post #121

I don't think that the city should be able to impose this arduous constraint on private businesses. These businesses have already suffered greatly under the capacity restrictions of closures. Now they're being asked to turn away potential customers and enforce unpopular rules without compensation, under threat of substantial penalties. If the city wants to impose this rule, then at the very least they should handle t…

Currently it’s actually the opposite in that the best restaurants are thriving because they ~doubled capacity by adding huge outdoor dining structures on the sidewalks that were previously not allowed. Note that it only impacts indoor dining not outdoor and that some restaurants, gyms, and venues has already begun to require of their own volition.

Re: NYC to mandate proof of vaccination for many indoor settings

#857

Post by ctoth »

pb7 wrote: post #855
ctoth wrote: post #849

I keep seeing an argument put forward that we should mandate getting vaccinated (and feel righteous about it!) to prevent the rise of a new scary variant that might bypass the vaccines. This argument, of course, is made by innumerate people who do not realize that the number of US holdouts is utterly dwarfed by the number of people who want a vaccine but can't get it no matter what. If we are worried about a new scar…

You can walk into any pharmacy and get vaccinated. We are long past demand exceeding supply. That's why vaccination rate graphs are plateauing and the numbers for 1-shot and fully vaccinated are converging.

Yes, here, in the US! According to the WHO, we're gonna need something like 11 billion vaccines[0] to cover the planet, however.

[0]: https://www.nytimes.com/2021/06/06/world/vaccine-coronavirus...

Re: NYC to mandate proof of vaccination for many indoor settings

#858

Post by chrismcb »

cratermoon wrote: post #141
Alex3917 wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It seems pretty weird to ask the indoor business owners to be the ones who are in charge of controlling that the vaccination rate is increasing and to be the one who are punished because the vaccination rate is not high enough. If their businesses are spreading the disease then it seems entirely reasonable.

Pretty much this. Businesses that are known to be problematic, like restaurants and bars, should expect that their choice to stay open and continue serving people comes with responsibilities. They don't operate free of consequences, and they shouldn't expect to externalize those consequences. However, it really sucks that the people who mostly end up trying to enforce the mandate are the staff who already have, in mo…

Are restaurants and bars known to be problematic?

Re: NYC to mandate proof of vaccination for many indoor settings

#859

Post by pb7 »

99_00 wrote: post #851
clukic wrote: post #197

Vaccine requirements have been in place for decades. For pre-K in NYC kids need shots for PCV and Hib. For kindergarten they need more shots: Hep B, Polio, Chickenpox, and Measles, Mumps and Rubella. Going to middle school? Then you'll need more shots, the TDAP and meningococcal conjugate. These are all vaccine requirements. Is it an invasion or privacy to demand children's records? Is it the nanny state? We could go…

I'm not American, but from the American news I watch a significant % of the population doesn't have the ability to get government ID. If they can't get that, how are they going to get vaccinated and maintain those records?

11% of Americans don't have government-issued ID. Not "don't have the ability" to get ID but don't have ID. They can get it with ease. Once we hit 89% vaccination rate then we can worry about that.

Re: NYC to mandate proof of vaccination for many indoor settings

#860

Post by mbg721 »

chrismcb wrote: post #858
cratermoon wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pretty much this. Businesses that are known to be problematic, like restaurants and bars, should expect that their choice to stay open and continue serving people comes with responsibilities. They don't operate free of consequences, and they shouldn't expect to externalize those consequences. However, it really sucks that the people who mostly end up trying to enforce the mandate are the staff who already have, in mo…

Are restaurants and bars known to be problematic?

They might be in the space of restauruncles.
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