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My small revenge on Apple

javierantonsblog.blogspot.com

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Re: My small revenge on Apple

#291

Post by collaborative »

spacedcowboy wrote: post #271
collaborative wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The reason "privacy" is in quotes is that some of us have started seeing through what Apple really means every time they use the word. As the EU's Executive Vice-President Margrethe Vestager has recently said regarding their Apple probe, privacy can't be an excuse to stifle competition. https://appleinsider.com/articles/21/07/02/eu-antitrust-head... All was well because nobody was forcing me (the developer) to includ…

Indeed it is. And I would choose to trust Apple over some nobody on the internet with a seeming chip on their shoulder (seriously, that post is just cringe ) over anyone who promoted Facebook and (to a lesser extent, obviously) Google as sign-in methods. In. A. Heartbeat. You claim (elsewhere) that you only send responsible-sounding emails, but the level of invective in your screed leads me to disbelieve you. Persona…

I challenge you to sign up (with Apple ID if you wish) and see for yourself how many emails you get. Otherwise you're accusing without evidence

I don't challenge that Apple ID is a good thing. I protest Apple's method of implementation

Re: My small revenge on Apple

#292

Post by krustyburger »

collaborative wrote: post #248
BugsJustFindMe wrote: post #243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> To this date To this date. Tomorrow, though, no one knows. > I have sent 0 marketing emails trying to sell stuff. "I", "I", "I". It's not you. It's me. I don't care what you say you're going to do with it. I don't want to give you my email address to store in another database. I'm sure you're very nice, but sorry not sorry. > The only reason email is needed is for password recovery You don't need my email at all if…

Not objecting. I don't need email addresses for the case of AppleID users. 100% true I do need them for everyone else who comes from traditional signup However, you seem to have missed the point. My problem is not AppleID, my problem is that Apple forced it on my app and threatened to shut me down if I didn't include it

Right, except that your “problem” is also the relationship Apple has with its customers. You did nothing to build the trust and loyalty that you mock in your snarky write-up. Apple did, to the point that their users would prefer to trust them with their personal information over someone else (you).

The tone of your whole piece is sophomoric- you essentially suggest that all of Apple’s customers are uninformed and lacking agency (unlike you).

All of this because you could no longer automatically glom some people’s emails for whatever future use you dream up? I hope you realize how you’re coming off.

Frankly, I wouldn’t be keen on you having my email. You might accuse me of “sitting on my butt” or worse if you decide I’m not a good customer or whatever.

Re: My small revenge on Apple

#293

Post by [deleted] »

somehnacct3757 wrote: post #233

I like the angle of "Sorry, Apple ID only works on Apple devices." The rest of the popup seems unprofessional and would make me reconsider using the software, out of fear for what other unprofessional things may end up happening. But the bit I highlight is a nice jab at Apple and something I think you can get away with professionally in a web app. It mars their login brand a bit by showing that it isn't useful everyw…

[deleted]

Re: My small revenge on Apple

#294

Post by xondono »

collaborative wrote: post #222
mosselman wrote: post #194

This is a perfect example of why Sign in with Apple is so great: it hides my e-mail and real name from people like the author who are clearly intent on using this information to sell me stuff I don't want.

To this date, I have sent 0 marketing emails trying to sell stuff. Heck, I don't even try to sell anything, I develop out of love and passion. The only reason email is needed is for password recovery But yes, Apple is great. Again, Apple is great. Apple good, good good good

And yet you ask your users to trust Apple and you and another developer for each app they use,

I’d rather just trust one party, and have a single entity to complain to.

Re: My small revenge on Apple

#295

Post by InsomniacL »

pokot0 wrote: post #264
collaborative wrote: post #248

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not objecting. I don't need email addresses for the case of AppleID users. 100% true I do need them for everyone else who comes from traditional signup However, you seem to have missed the point. My problem is not AppleID, my problem is that Apple forced it on my app and threatened to shut me down if I didn't include it

You don't want to understand. Apple users are happy that they forced you. They like the AppleID experience and nobody would care to implement it if they didn't force developers. I know it's frustrating for you, but this is the core of why Apple users stick to Apple. They decided to trust and share their data with one single company (Apple) instead of an overwhelming amount of small companies. And it's not just about…

> Apple users are happy that they forced you.

As an Apple user I'm not happy they forced this. It's manipulative forcing even more platform lock-in for the average joe which empowers other anti-trust practices too.

You're argument that an Apple user is happy at the point of use doesn't justify anti-trust behaviour which is to the overall detriment of people.

Apple seem to get away with far too much just because they're 'Apple'.

Imagine the mess we would be in if every auth provider had the same policy.

Re: My small revenge on Apple

#296

Post by addison-lee »

> look ugly and inconsistent

Hate to break it to you, your app is already ugly, the thin black border around the Apple sign in doesn’t change the fact the rest of the app looks awful. Also you’re not getting “revenge” on Apple, you are just fucking over your users who use Apple.

Re: My small revenge on Apple

#297

Post by CivBase »

mikeryan wrote: post #241
mosselman wrote: post #194

This is a perfect example of why Sign in with Apple is so great: it hides my e-mail and real name from people like the author who are clearly intent on using this information to sell me stuff I don't want.

It’s also the reason they had to make it mandatory. No one would use it otherwise. I use it all the time for the privacy it provides.

That's evidently not true. Plenty of apps, including the author's, use Google's and Facebook's auth solutions without being coerced into doing so.

EDIT: Can someone explain how this is wrong?

Re: My small revenge on Apple

#298

Post by uncomputation »

rovek wrote: post #39
Toutouxc wrote: post #29

> The best way to convince Apple prisoners is to tell them what they need. Trust must only belong to Apple. Give them your money, your will, your worship, your everything. Apple will keep you safe > Perhaps Apple customers deserve the luxury of "choice" (between different Apple devices, of course) I don't understand the tone. Do these people actually not understand that different people have different preferences and…

Your second quote conveniently chops out the main point of the article, which is that Apple abuse their dominance to force developers into having no choice.

I don’t see the abuse here. Sign In with Apple is only required if you already support Facebook or Google or another third-party social sign in. If you support only email and password, that’s fine. If you do support social sign in, presumably you do so because then you don’t have to worry about passwords and stuff. Well, this is exactly the same. I don’t see why it makes a difference.

Re: My small revenge on Apple

#299

Post by Orphis »

sleepydog wrote: post #234
mwexler wrote: post #221

Does "sign in with X" not lock you into X's ecosystem? That is, if I lose my Apple account or my Google account due to their judgement of my actions, have I lost access to the services I authed via those accounts? That is, if I change my email, most services allow that data to migrate to the new username. Do the "sign in with X" allow the same capabilities? (I ask from ignorance, not from sarcasm, I really don't know…

Theoretically a service could allow you to convert an externally authenticated account to one protected by a password. In practice, I haven't found any services that allow it. I've found plenty that support conversion in the other direction.

Spotify used to do this.

Re: My small revenge on Apple

#300

Post by collaborative »

echelon wrote: post #285
collaborative wrote: post #272

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks, the web app isn't published yet and I will take this into consideration

Thank you for fighting the good fight. Apple is making it impossible to have real customers and real businesses. They're turning us into serfs of their unfair ecosystem. It's one thing to build interconnected products, but to grow the pie so large that all commerce and communication with 50% of Americans goes through their polished gates, to be stripped, taxed, and even cloned, is an abuse of power and position. It's…

Thanks mate, I will gladly join you in being downvoted and add that in the long term it would really help if us developers got more organized. We need collective action. I have a few thoughts on this, anyone who wishes to join forces in carrying this baby can get in touch at javierantonf@hotmail.com
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