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I went to the office for the first time. I fucking hated it

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Re: I went to the office for the first time. I fucking hated it

#281

Post by simonh »

carlmr wrote: post #189
playcache wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It does heavily slant towards managers. Their perceived value is often build around knowing and reporting up on what others are doing. Remote work really shook the tree and exposed this.

How did remote work expose that managers are managing people? The issue I see exposed is rather the top-heaviness of many modern companies where there are too many managers and too few people that do actual work. If you're a manager and doing low level work you're doing it wrong. Your role is to remove the interpersonal roadblocks, get people to pull in the same direction, inspire with your vision, hire the right peo…

I'd say another role of a manager is protecting the team from external interference and time-draining activities. You don't get to see that side of it as a team member, or shouldn't if your manager is doing a good job.

Re: I went to the office for the first time. I fucking hated it

#282

Post by bradlys »

brailsafe wrote: post #232
ohhnoodont wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This may just be my experience as a young person in San Francisco / Silicon Valley, but it's very common for office life and social life to be highly intertwined. I don't necessarily see this as a bad thing. Many of us moved here and joined competitive, demanding companies. People bond in these situations. I really look forward to being back in the office and having a significant part of my social life return. Don't…

It is a bad thing, for the reason you just eluded to. Your work goes away for any reason, and so does your social life. This is why many of my friends haven't made any real friends since highschool

I mean, nothing is stopping you from making friends outside of work too though. It’s just another avenue for socializing. WFH though means that socializing is likely completely off the table. Fine if you’re not into it - sucks a lot if you are. I really miss lunches with my coworkers. It was almost always the highlight of my day - if I didn’t do anything else after work.

Re: I went to the office for the first time. I fucking hated it

#283

Post by Freak_NL »

foxpurple wrote: post #236
rococode wrote: post #131

I predict the balance we're heading towards for many office jobs is going to be something like 2 mandatory office days a week, 1 optional day, and 2 mandatory WFH days, with "mandatory" really meaning "highly encouraged". Like Monday and Wednesday are in-office, Tuesday and Thursday are WFH, Friday is optional. Preference for WFH depends on so many individual factors, not just personality but also your commute length…

I would suggest that Friday makes a good time for the mandatory day. Means people can go out for drinks at the end of the day. The in office days will never be as productive but they can be good socialising times so you may as well make use of that.

There is also a trend towards four-day work weeks to account for. I work 4 × 8, and Friday is a good day to have off; you get a long weekend and unlike Monday¹ shops are open in the morning too.

1: This may be a Dutch phenomenon, but many shops and amenities are closed on Monday morning. Especially with the gradual increase of shops being open on Sunday afternoons.

Re: I went to the office for the first time. I fucking hated it

#284

Post by itronitron »

amdelamar wrote: post #44

> The best part is that the cubicle doesn't have tall walls so I can literally see/hear everything, including other people's monitors. Open offices are awful. In my experience most people end up wearing headphones all day, and I did too. My ears would get red and irritated after a while. But I'd keep them on because it was like an unspoken social rule; that if you looked busy and had headphones on, people won't inter…

I wonder if wearing a reflective face shield would be a more effective deterrent to interruptions. If people can't see your face then they would probably be much less likely to engage in conversation. You could just take a normal face shield and put reflective sunscreen window film on the inside.

Re: I went to the office for the first time. I fucking hated it

#285

Post by oneeyedpigeon »

Apocryphon wrote: post #204
CephalopodMD wrote: post #119

I just want my own office. That's all. I'd be pretty okay with going in if I had my own office with 4 walls. First job of my career, they told me I would have an office of my own. First day I come back do for full time (I had interned there too with my own office), they tell me they're switching buildings to go open office in about a month's time. I got a precious few weeks with a personal office, and then it was all…

Perhaps companies that require physical offices could try to offer a compromise incentive: personal offices or actual cubicles instead of open office layouts. At least that would solve many of the pain points of physically working in tech. Maybe personal offices are too expensive, but how much does it cost to set up cubes?

Flexibility is key, IMO. A cube/personal office might be desired, but it doesn't solve the time & cost problems associated with travelling into an office. And there will be some like me who prefer an open office environment to an enclosed space.

Re: I went to the office for the first time. I fucking hated it

#286

Post by jstummbillig »

brailsafe wrote: post #232
ohhnoodont wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This may just be my experience as a young person in San Francisco / Silicon Valley, but it's very common for office life and social life to be highly intertwined. I don't necessarily see this as a bad thing. Many of us moved here and joined competitive, demanding companies. People bond in these situations. I really look forward to being back in the office and having a significant part of my social life return. Don't…

It is a bad thing, for the reason you just eluded to. Your work goes away for any reason, and so does your social life. This is why many of my friends haven't made any real friends since highschool

> Your work goes away for any reason, and so does your social life.

Sure, as can be true after leaving school or moving away from family. Reason enough to always foster the skill of both making and keeping friends.

Re: I went to the office for the first time. I fucking hated it

#287

Post by WesolyKubeczek »

angarg12 wrote: post #181

I have several colleagues in the same situation (first job, never been to the office). As much as I love remote work, a word of caution: don't take this text too seriously. It's just the ramblings of a very immature engineer. Form your own opinion rather than using a second hand toxic one. Try it out. It turns out different people like different things, and also circumstances are different. If something doesn't work,…

I guess social climbing and engagement in office politics are sure signs of maturity, then.

Re: I went to the office for the first time. I fucking hated it

#288

Post by Lewton »

brailsafe wrote: post #232
ohhnoodont wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This may just be my experience as a young person in San Francisco / Silicon Valley, but it's very common for office life and social life to be highly intertwined. I don't necessarily see this as a bad thing. Many of us moved here and joined competitive, demanding companies. People bond in these situations. I really look forward to being back in the office and having a significant part of my social life return. Don't…

It is a bad thing, for the reason you just eluded to. Your work goes away for any reason, and so does your social life. This is why many of my friends haven't made any real friends since highschool

I'm still regularly meeting up with a group of ex-colleagues from a company I left 5 years ago

Re: I went to the office for the first time. I fucking hated it

#289

Post by mathverse »

sam0x17 wrote: post #94
Wowfunhappy wrote: post #4

> If you like/prefer going to the office that is fine. I am not trying to say we should all be remote. Companies should offer FLEXIBILITY to let employees choose where to work from. That doesn’t work. I prefer working in the office, but only if the rest of my team is actually there with me. If some people are remote, then we have to do Zoom meetings, so I may as well be remote too.

I hate that people keep framing it as a "preference" issue. There are HUGE economic and environmental costs that go along with working in and (often) commuting to an office. Not to mention the consistent 20-30% productivity drain working in an office seems to have across the board at most tech orgs. We don't need to destroy our planet, dramatically increase costs, and dramatically lower productivity just to appease t…

In my opinion this is an argument fallacy.Almost any economic activity causes pollution and spike in environmental and economic costs.

Moving to WFH will not do anything to reduce emissions and it could actually lead to an opposite outcome due to increased consumption as people would have more time to travel longer distances.

Re: I went to the office for the first time. I fucking hated it

#290

Post by thevagrant »

AmericanChopper wrote: post #267
tchvil wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One programming teacher told me 20 years ago: "you think your technical skills will make you advance your career, wrong, it is your interpersonal ones that will do". I'm not very good at it, but since then I try to work on both sides.

People tend to think this is some form of injustice, but the real reason is that most people work as part of a team, and your ability to deliver value as a team member is constrained by you ability to work as a team member. The anecdote I have for my office is the complete opposite of the parents comments anecdote. The least productive members stayed at home as much as possible, and the most productive ones are in th…

It may depend on the company and the team. In the office I get asked questions or interrupted frequently. I enjoy talking to colleagues and it seems productive. However the bulk of my important work is done alone in longer uninterrupted blocks of time (at home). If I'm forced into an office then unless the team around me is really good/organised, I end up working at home at night to get those uninterrupted blocks of time. My wellbeing long term suffers.

Collaborating with others works as well for me over a video call as it does in person. Further, the hours I save commuting to the office I can use to solve or collaborate on something else.

Most people I've talked to concerned about those not being in the office appear to think those out of office are on holiday. If a manager is worried their remote staff are not on task, why not give them a call?

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