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Anna Kiesenhofer: Mathematician, amateur cyclist, Olympic champion

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Re: Anna Kiesenhofer: Mathematician, amateur cyclist, Olympic champion

#151

Post by TomVDB »

spodek wrote: post #52
pythko wrote: post #18

Some additional context for those who don't follow professional cycling: the Dutch women's team was incredibly strong coming into this road race. All 4 riders on their team are stars in their own right, and the only reason there wasn't a clear favorite for the race overall is that people weren't sure which Dutch rider would win. So you have a complicated group dynamic, where the majority of the peloton has no interes…

> All credit to her for an extremely strong ride. And a better strategy, which is a major part of competition. People commenting on her being lucky. She had a better strategy.

She won deservedly. And it was very entertaining.

But there was luck involved, and in 99% of the cases, it’d be terrible advice and strategy to count on a major communications breakdown within the team of top favorites and (apparently) within the organization of the race themselves?

“Strategy” is one of those words that’s used way too much in hindsight.

Re: Anna Kiesenhofer: Mathematician, amateur cyclist, Olympic champion

#152

Post by TomVDB »

diskzero wrote: post #121
croes wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The others had no strategy because they didn't know she were upfront.

Other than showing up on time for the race, step one of your plan for winning is knowing the position of your competitors. This is road racing 101.

You’re not wrong. Eating well and training hard is also racing 101.

But that has nothing to do with having a better strategy.

Re: Anna Kiesenhofer: Mathematician, amateur cyclist, Olympic champion

#153

Post by [deleted] »

headmelted wrote: post #149
TomVDB wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s easy to underestimate a break-away rider when you don’t know that there is one. The silver medal winner thought she had won the race. They need a kick for not communicating amongst themselves.

I heard something early on about a communication failure, not sure how much truth there is in that. Nonetheless, it was an incredible performance - right down to her collapsing to the ground victorious in tears at the line. I laughed a little when I saw the Danish competitor come to congratulate her with a big smile while the Dutch team two meters away wouldn’t even acknowledge she was there - no point being bitter a…

[deleted]

Re: Anna Kiesenhofer: Mathematician, amateur cyclist, Olympic champion

#154

Post by rocqua »

frereubu wrote: post #124
rocqua wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because otherwise the Olympics for road cycling and actual high-level road cycling races become totally different things. The entire game of road cycling races is based on judging these gaps. Without it, you would probably never let anyone ride off. Then races become attrition, followed by sprint. Either that or you get a weird spotting system where people try to get gap timings to the riders through unofficial chann…

I'm talking about the whole of cycling, not just the Olympics, so the first point doesn't stand. Do you really prefer the spectacle of the peloton letting a breakaway head off into the distance, knowing that in 95% of cases they can just reel it back in just enough not to have an effect on the GC? Today just showed how exciting it is when people can head off down the road far enough for the others not to know what's…

I think that you can do a lot against the 'optimized races' by giving riders the timing info reliably _without_ giving them radio communications with their teams. I also think that currently, the races are actually quite fun. Even in the sky times in the TDF, there were breakaways with a chance, there were people who would solo to a victory.

I don't think unofficial channels are ever going to be policeable. Obfuscation is too potent. And I don't think it would be interesting if teams start competing to be better at getting their riders extra info. Even though I think its quite fun to try to design such systems.

Re: Anna Kiesenhofer: Mathematician, amateur cyclist, Olympic champion

#155

Post by slms »

croes wrote: post #101
spodek wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> All credit to her for an extremely strong ride. And a better strategy, which is a major part of competition. People commenting on her being lucky. She had a better strategy.

The others had no strategy because they didn't know she were upfront.

They still shouldn't have given the breakaway 10 minutes in a race as hard to control as this (with teams of 4). In the men's race, the favourite teams (Belgium and Slovenia) sacrificed riders earlier (Greg van Avermaet and Jan Tratnik respectively) to maintain the breakaway on a leash. The dutch women were arrogant and they paid for it.

Re: Anna Kiesenhofer: Mathematician, amateur cyclist, Olympic champion

#156

Post by TomK32 »

lmilcin wrote: post #86
TomK32 wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why 5k when it's only a week since Austrian Christoph Strasser set the records for 1000 (one thousand) kilometers, in just under a day (with 2 minutes total for breaks and clothes changes).

Because I ran distances from 5k to marathon (with 10k being my favourite) and so I know from my own experience. I have no knowledge of how you run a 1000k run.

Ah, 5k running. I was still on topic with cycling. Sorry.

Re: Anna Kiesenhofer: Mathematician, amateur cyclist, Olympic champion

#157

Post by TomK32 »

Andrew_nenakhov wrote: post #108
TomK32 wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ahhh, no. No! NO! The Olympics as envisioned by Coubertin didn't allow professionals for a very long time, A VERY LONG TIME. For boxers this year is actually the first Olympics that do accept professionals. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Olympic_Games#Amateurism_and_p...

Curiously, every single soviet sports athlete who ever competed on any international event was considered an amateur, while in fact being a full time professional devoted to his sport. Usually they were officially 'working' at some factory, but were members of a sports club and received a substantial stipend, never doing any work but training and competing. This practice still lives in Russia. The income of any Olymp…

It's the same for most countries, Germany has the Sportsoldat, employed by the military (and even more employed by the police) and they make up the majority of the German Olympic team. Not everyone likes this in Germany, but there's not much of an alternative in sight. The American U.S. Army World Class Athlete Program is tiny compared to the German practise.

Re: Anna Kiesenhofer: Mathematician, amateur cyclist, Olympic champion

#158

Post by michaelt »

TomVDB wrote: post #151
spodek wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> All credit to her for an extremely strong ride. And a better strategy, which is a major part of competition. People commenting on her being lucky. She had a better strategy.

She won deservedly. And it was very entertaining. But there was luck involved, and in 99% of the cases, it’d be terrible advice and strategy to count on a major communications breakdown within the team of top favorites and (apparently) within the organization of the race themselves? “Strategy” is one of those words that’s used way too much in hindsight.

In any other sport, being ahead of the favourite by a wide margin for much of a race, then crossing the finishing line so far ahead that the second-place athlete isn't even in view, would be called a "resounding victory" rather than "lucky"

Re: Anna Kiesenhofer: Mathematician, amateur cyclist, Olympic champion

#159

Post by i_am_new_here »

: Does incredible things, that typically men are way better at (math and sports) and: She even does 2 of them, at the same time and to the very best. Incredible. Bravo!

How plausible/believable. And what an adorable women and a role model for other girls. And we need so many more female role models to inspire as many young girls as possible (ideally: All of them).

Having kids and a family (with a man,... a protector?!) is really lame and needs to be avoided. Top notch careers are much more important. I mean: Who doesn't want to be remembered by the random name that was given to you - First name by your parents, last name by people in the middle ages struggling to keep people apart during rapid population growth. I feel very inspired now.

Thank you journalist (w/m/d) for writing this article.

It is clear that men are all grabbing for these enviable positions just for the sake of it (and not as a means for anything else) and we need to get women there, too.

Re: Anna Kiesenhofer: Mathematician, amateur cyclist, Olympic champion

#160

Post by varjag »

pythko wrote: post #18

Some additional context for those who don't follow professional cycling: the Dutch women's team was incredibly strong coming into this road race. All 4 riders on their team are stars in their own right, and the only reason there wasn't a clear favorite for the race overall is that people weren't sure which Dutch rider would win. So you have a complicated group dynamic, where the majority of the peloton has no interes…

Victory has man fathers (or in this case mothers), but defeat is an orphan.
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