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PinePhone – Open Source Smart Phone Supported by Major Linux Phone Projects

pine64.org

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Re: PinePhone – Open Source Smart Phone Supported by Major Linux Phone Projects

#131

Post by mattkevan »

linmob wrote: post #60
numpad0 wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the “open source vs commercial” framing can be adjusted slightly: Proprietary UI products are great and FOSS CLI software are great too. The difference is that businesses require scaling, parallelism, distributed stake holding always, and that many parts of non-code product developments scale, while code authoring don’t/must not be. That causes open source UI to be just under-resourced development compared to…

“Under-resourced” is a good way to put it. There’s often a lack of UX design and thus a lack of polish – since there’s often no money to be made, there’s little to no incentive to bring it up from “works for me” to “works for everybody seamlessly“. (I’ll spare us all the Pareto 80%/20% theory here, although I am pretty sure that it applies here.) The upside is that open source or free software features fewer (and oft…

There’s also quite a scorn in parts of the open source world for UX and design in general.

Attempts at making software more approachable are accused of dumbing down or prioritising form over function. There’s an attitude that it’s not ‘real work’ if you don’t have to memorise tonnes of inscrutable commands or spend ages tinkering with config files.

Re: PinePhone – Open Source Smart Phone Supported by Major Linux Phone Projects

#133

Post by d110af5ccf »

NhanH wrote: post #35
throwawayswede wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a poor argument. Usually this happens to "tech savvy" people when they like to tinker with their system on daily basis and use bleeding edge software (since you have unlimited customizability, unlike the competition), you're bound to have issues. Normal users can just use an LTS release and (for the average user) they won't even be able to tell the difference. Talk to anyone who installs beta iOS versions and…

There is a fairly high chance that beta iOS would smoke even Debian stable out of the window in term of stability for end users. I run Windows with Windows Insider enabled with Dev channel (basically the most beta Windows there is), and no Ubuntu version I've used came close to that Windows setup with regards to stability. I choose to use Linux despite the bad UX and bad stability for end user. Linux server (and pack…

This does not match my experience at all. Debian stable is hands down the most robust and well tested collection of software I have ever used. All issues have been on my end - either hardware failure or my own ignorance while mucking about in the configs.

LibreOffice specifically had serious stability issues a few years ago but has been much better lately. You could run Microsoft Office under Wine all along though (or use Google Docs, etc). Nothing preventing you from paying for stable software in that particular case.

Admittedly 3D graphics (not 2D office applications) can be rocky depending on your vendor. I've had good luck with AMD lately (but not in the past). That's entirely the fault of the vendors (AMD & Nvidia) though. Integrated Intel is and always has been absolutely flawless.

Re: PinePhone – Open Source Smart Phone Supported by Major Linux Phone Projects

#134

Post by d110af5ccf »

fendy3002 wrote: post #113
that_guy_iain wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That is not true. As far as I am concerned Linux is clearly superior OS for my laptop over commercial alternatives. I love Linux. I'm a Linux desktop user but I can 100% say my experience is degraded compared to mac and windows users. Not just in apps that are there but in small things like sometimes it changes which mic is being used without telling me. Driver support is also a thing. I have my GUI crash on me on…

> I have my GUI crash on me on a semi regular basis That's true for me at 16.04 or below. I don't really remember encountering one on 18.04 or 20.04 though. May share your use case?

Same here. As of 18.04LTS Ubuntu has been more stable than Windows 7 ever was for me.

Re: PinePhone – Open Source Smart Phone Supported by Major Linux Phone Projects

#135

Post by throwawayswede »

gm wrote: post #19
that_guy_iain wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Once they get the software worked out over the next few years though, it'll be the best thing out there. No ads, no bullshit, just a phone with a mainline linux distribution. I'm coming to the realisation that open source projects will always provide a lower quality than comerical ones. How can we honestly expect a small team of developers to compete with the larger teams a commerical project can afford? The realit…

I'm with you, but this is the wrong place to come and say that. That attacks the ego of many people on here. EDIT: But read the other comments on here and they actually prove you right: First hand reports of low build quality by the same manufacturer (downvoted, of course), someone saying "someone should just add X feature and I'd buy it" (as opposed to true-to-open-source "I'll add X feature, which will make it it a…

The careers of many people (not just technical) who work in a business relying on the technology these days would not exist in the same way without open source and free software (that whatever product or software you are currently to make those comments relies on).

There's nothing wrong with criticism, but to give simplistic arguments (if they can be called arguments event) and say that it's "low quality" or "will not work" is just absolutely incorrect. But when it gets defended you call it "attacks the ego of many people"? That's just ridicules.

Re: PinePhone – Open Source Smart Phone Supported by Major Linux Phone Projects

#136

Post by heavenlyblue »

habibur wrote: post #91
theodric wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You have a strange definition of "great." If any other phone exhibited those characteristics, I would write it off as garbage, not excuse its faults with a promise that they'll be fixed Real Soon Now™

He was just being polite. Standard unwritten rule : start with a single supportive positive line on a thing and then follow it by a whole page of criticism.

The classical “shit sandwich”.

Re: PinePhone – Open Source Smart Phone Supported by Major Linux Phone Projects

#137

Post by lasagnaphil »

fsflover wrote: post #120
nousermane wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Depends on which year's. Pine64's SoC, Allwinner A64 is 4x 1,2 GHz Cortex-A53 chip, giving you about the same level of raw performance as a 2013 flagship phone.

And it will run smoothly, if you choose simple software: https://sr.ht/~mil/Sxmo/ .

Though from a few videos it's got an incredibly primitive UI that mainly uses the side buttons instead of the big touchscreen. The interface seems much more apt for a feature phone than a smartphone. (Though I realize there can be some niche demand for a non-touchscreen Linux phone with a hardware keyboard... Maybe that's what might be more achievable in the FOSS Linux hobbyist scene than something like the Pinephone or the Librem 5.)

Re: PinePhone – Open Source Smart Phone Supported by Major Linux Phone Projects

#138

Post by tluyben2 »

emteycz wrote: post #88
theodric wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You have a strange definition of "great." If any other phone exhibited those characteristics, I would write it off as garbage, not excuse its faults with a promise that they'll be fixed Real Soon Now™

Don't forget about the price: $200 doesn't get you flagship experience.

Lately I have been trying out $200 range phones (with Android): the galaxy A31 for instance: it is the experience of a flagship phone from a few years ago. If the pinephone was that, I think everyone would be happy and yes, this is possible for $200. At least if you are Samsung?

So yeah, not flagship but close enough for a lot of people (side by side, the a32 vs s21, for me is not worth the 4x+ pricetag, as in the difference between flagship and not flagship is shrinking fast, ymmv), however...

The pinephone is worse hardware though (In almost all respects but the dipswitches) and the software, at this point, is really alpha quality mostly. But we know this: the promise it will run Linux smoothly on a phone is enough to buy one. It will take time but I would buy any phone that allows me to freely run multiple OSs new out of the box with all hardware supported.

Re: PinePhone – Open Source Smart Phone Supported by Major Linux Phone Projects

#139

Post by d110af5ccf »

1vuio0pswjnm7 wrote: post #78
dsr_ wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No end user could run anything on a DangerOS device that didn't come from the store; nothing went into the store that wasn't written in Java and met their guidelines. Pinephone is completely orthogonal to this.

"Pinephone is completely orthogonal to this." Do you mean Pine64 has no intention of trying to control what people do with the device? Did anyone ever try to "root" the Sidekick? Always interested to hear more about it.

> Do you mean Pine64 has no intention of trying to control what people do with the device?

Explicitly not trying to control what you do makes up the majority of their business model.

Re: PinePhone – Open Source Smart Phone Supported by Major Linux Phone Projects

#140

Post by fsflover »

bullen wrote: post #128
fsflover wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://puri.sm/products/librem-5 https://forums.puri.sm/t/comparing-specs-of-upcoming-linux-p...

the librem is a bit too clunky and expensive, probability of pine adding a newer GPU is higher!

Probability is higher than what? Librem 5 is already there, whereas next Pinephone is not really on the horizon.
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