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SARS-CoV-2 Gamma variant infected 16 fully Pfizer vaccinated Guiana gold miners

wwwnc.cdc.gov

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Re: SARS-CoV-2 Gamma variant infected 16 fully Pfizer vaccinated Guiana gold miners

#161

Post by native_samples »

evgen wrote: post #122
mlang23 wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is very likely. And has already been said by various critics already months ago. But these people were silenced or ridiculed, because it apparently was already decided the vaccines need to be sold.

Completely untrue. The reservoir of selfish unvaccinated individuals is what is providing a place for Covid to hide and mutate. Vax critics were silenced and ridiculed because they are dangerous deceivers who need to be called out and held to account for the consequences of their lies.

That's not something that's ever been a problem with vaccines before.

Even if you have unshakeable faith in this evidence-free perversion of biological theory, nobody was claiming the vaccines will fail without 100% adoption last year when they launched. Their reception would have been rather different if that had been claimed, wouldn't it? So you can either believe this is true, in which case governments and pharma firms deceived people about the nature of the 'vaccine', or you can believe it's false and they didn't. But you can't believe it's true and it's the other people who are deceivers. That makes no logical sense.

Re: SARS-CoV-2 Gamma variant infected 16 fully Pfizer vaccinated Guiana gold miners

#162

Post by nikolay »

criticaltinker wrote: post #84

As other commenters have noted, this case study further supports the widespread observations that COVID-19 vaccines reduce the chance of severe (symptomatic) illness but do not necessarily prevent infection and transmission. The authors of this study conjecture that the unvaccinated asymptomatic “patient 40” may have been the source of the infections seen in the other fully vaccinated patients - however this was a mi…

Many young people have still a low chance of severe course of the disease but they are pushed to get vaccinated. My issue with the disease is not the severe course, which some people are pretty well protected from, but the lasting tissue and organ damage going thru the infection with or without a vaccine. I yet have to see a study showing that vaccines prevent such damage. We will have huge epidemics of CVDs after this is over as nobody really pays now close attention to people who pass thru the disease with or without symptoms.

Re: SARS-CoV-2 Gamma variant infected 16 fully Pfizer vaccinated Guiana gold miners

#163

Post by thirsty-dove »

evgen wrote: post #122
mlang23 wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is very likely. And has already been said by various critics already months ago. But these people were silenced or ridiculed, because it apparently was already decided the vaccines need to be sold.

Completely untrue. The reservoir of selfish unvaccinated individuals is what is providing a place for Covid to hide and mutate. Vax critics were silenced and ridiculed because they are dangerous deceivers who need to be called out and held to account for the consequences of their lies.

It's not selfish to decline a medical procedure one thinks is unlikely to benefit oneself. Furthermore, it's malpractice for a doctor to advise a patient to undergo a medical procedure that is not more likely than not to benefit that specific patient. Your attitude is what's dangerous.

Re: SARS-CoV-2 Gamma variant infected 16 fully Pfizer vaccinated Guiana gold miners

#164

Post by jstanley »

seventytwo wrote: post #48
flybrand wrote: post #27

“Attack rate was 0/6 among persons with a previous history of COVID-19 versus 63.2% among those with no previous history (Table).”

… and 99% of cases in the US are among the unvaccinated. What’s your point?

But the US methodology of deciding whether you have COVID is much more strict if you've been vaccinated - this just fudges the numbers to make it look like vaccines work much better than they really do.

Re: SARS-CoV-2 Gamma variant infected 16 fully Pfizer vaccinated Guiana gold miners

#165

Post by yyyk »

dot1x wrote: post #133
criticaltinker wrote: post #84

As other commenters have noted, this case study further supports the widespread observations that COVID-19 vaccines reduce the chance of severe (symptomatic) illness but do not necessarily prevent infection and transmission. The authors of this study conjecture that the unvaccinated asymptomatic “patient 40” may have been the source of the infections seen in the other fully vaccinated patients - however this was a mi…

> That being said, IMO there seems to be a growing public opinion that unvaccinated individuals are to blame for the increasing dominance of variants of concern (delta, gamma, etc). This is no coincidence. The media has been directed to _not_ blame vaccines for ANYTHING, as doing so would negatively impact their narrative. It's well known that people vaccinated with leaky vaccines are the breeding ground for super-bu…

'It's well known that people vaccinated with leaky vaccines are the breeding ground for super-bugs, especially between they get their 1st and 2nd dose.'

It's well known immunocompromised people are breeding grounds. One way to avoid that is vaccinating them early.

'it will not generate multi-epitope antibodies any longer as it'll think "it got this handled" due to previous (incomplete) antibodies.'

The immune system knows to benchmark existing antidotes. If the spike antibody isn't enough it will stop producing it.

Re: SARS-CoV-2 Gamma variant infected 16 fully Pfizer vaccinated Guiana gold miners

#166

Post by AstralStorm »

native_samples wrote: post #150
murphyslab wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> imperfect vaccines can cause selective pressure which enhances the fitness of highly virulent pathogens The number of ways in which we undertaking a natural experiment in viral evolution has been top-of-mind for me as well. But the greater issue in my view is not that the vaccines are imperfect. All vaccines are somewhat imperfect. On its own, I the mRNA vaccines were probably entirely adequate. The problem is that…

The mRNA vaccines are not "adequate": they are being treated by governments as if they aren't working whilst also being significantly more dangerous than every other vaccine programme out there by a long way, even according to the CDC's own rather unreliable VAERS data. Look at the graph here and repeat that these vaccines are adequate: https://swprs.org/us-vaccine-deaths-increasing-rapidly/ "the human population, as…

Re 2. Which programs? Not even polio vaccinations worked to eradicate the virus completely, and these came the closest.

Much less BCG or variola (pox).

Viruses like flu and coronaviruses, nigh impossible to eradicate.

1 and 3, sure. And mRNA vaccine is not particularly more dangerous than any other type. The cost-benefit is strongly on the side of vaccination there.

Re: SARS-CoV-2 Gamma variant infected 16 fully Pfizer vaccinated Guiana gold miners

#167

Post by thirsty-dove »

ben_w wrote: post #132
jsbdk wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would I want to vaccinate if I'm still going to get restricted? I mean the whole deal here was that if we got vaccinated we'd be back to normal life. If that wasn't the case they should've been sincere up front and most of us wouldn't have gotten vaccinated.

Same reason I want to wear a seatbelt even though I’m still restricted by the speed limit: demonstrably lower chances of not merely death but also sub-fatal harm.

Doesn't seem like a good comparison, because seat belts have been tested for decades and don't seem to be insidiously harmful, whereas VAERS already has an off-the-charts number of reports of deaths and harm. Not a day goes by where I don't hear about somebody dying shortly after getting the vaccine, often in novel ways like described here: https://freewestmedia.com/2021/06/27/surgeon-who-operated-on...

Re: SARS-CoV-2 Gamma variant infected 16 fully Pfizer vaccinated Guiana gold miners

#168

Post by yyyk »

jstanley wrote: post #159
yyyk wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1) All current variations of concern come from mostly unvaccinated countries. Apparently there's a serious issue with immunocompromised individuals and the vaccines may help prevent that: https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/covid-variants-ma... 2) We can see with SARS and MERS that a more deadly form may actually reduce overall mortality, since the virus can't spread as effectively. However, we haven't had thi…

> All current variations of concern come from mostly unvaccinated countries. Isn't it more significant not where they emerge (which is by random mutation) but where they do well? And don't they seem to do well in countries that have vaccinated more people? Is it even particularly easy to say where a variant originated? Could the mutations happen multiple times independently?

>Isn't it more significant not where they emerge (which is by random mutation) but where they do well?

Random mutation happens more when we give it more chances, by letting it infect more unprotected people. We'd rather avoid that, so it's also important.

>Is it even particularly easy to say where a variant originated?

No, but we have gene sampling to help.

>Could the mutations happen multiple times independently?

They can and sometimes do happen independently.

Re: SARS-CoV-2 Gamma variant infected 16 fully Pfizer vaccinated Guiana gold miners

#169

Post by yyyk »

erdewit wrote: post #153
yyyk wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1) All current variations of concern come from mostly unvaccinated countries. Apparently there's a serious issue with immunocompromised individuals and the vaccines may help prevent that: https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/covid-variants-ma... 2) We can see with SARS and MERS that a more deadly form may actually reduce overall mortality, since the virus can't spread as effectively. However, we haven't had thi…

From the article: > Analysis of samples from the patient showed that the virus evolved rapidly after the plasma therapy, developing mutations that changed how it could infect cells and resist antibodies. Seems to be that the plasma therapy (injecting antibodies) is responsible here.

There are cases of mutation in immunocompromised preceding plasma therapy, e.g.:

https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2021/02/05/9644470...

Re: SARS-CoV-2 Gamma variant infected 16 fully Pfizer vaccinated Guiana gold miners

#170

Post by scotty79 »

nikolay wrote: post #162
criticaltinker wrote: post #84

As other commenters have noted, this case study further supports the widespread observations that COVID-19 vaccines reduce the chance of severe (symptomatic) illness but do not necessarily prevent infection and transmission. The authors of this study conjecture that the unvaccinated asymptomatic “patient 40” may have been the source of the infections seen in the other fully vaccinated patients - however this was a mi…

Many young people have still a low chance of severe course of the disease but they are pushed to get vaccinated. My issue with the disease is not the severe course, which some people are pretty well protected from, but the lasting tissue and organ damage going thru the infection with or without a vaccine. I yet have to see a study showing that vaccines prevent such damage. We will have huge epidemics of CVDs after th…

It is possible that covid gives you brain damage even if you have mild symptoms https://www.businessinsider.com/covid-19-survivors-gray-matt...

Not sure if vaccines prevent any of this.

They surely prevent damage by reducing infection rates in fully vaccinated, but not sure if they can save you from damage, same way they are saving you from death if you contract the virus anyways.

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.07.13.21260393v...

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