The Framework Laptop is now shipping • Hacker News Board

Re: The Framework Laptop is now shipping

#301

Post by nspattak » Fri, Jul 23, 2021, 8:37 AM UTC

ribit wrote: post #286

victor9000 wrote: post #254

This device is seriously the answer to all my laptop problems. I really like the form factor of the XPS 13, but now I'm stuck with the complete inability to upgrade RAM. In what universe is that normal? Then I accidentally nuked the USB-C ports on the left side when it got wet, and now I'm left with a single port for everything, including charging. What!? Why? I tore the entire thing apart and there's just no way to…

> In what universe is that normal? In a universe where you want high-performance energy efficient RAM. Premium ultracompact laptops have long moved to LPDDR which is both faster and consumes significantly less energy than regular modular DDR. And LPDDR does not come in DIMMs. And then you have Apple who are using custom package technology with custom RAM chips to cut down RAM power consumption to under one watt activ…

Can you please point us to some technical report or something where they document the energy saving of moving from dimm slots to soldered ram/ssd ?

Re: The Framework Laptop is now shipping

#302

Post by andresgottlieb » Fri, Jul 23, 2021, 8:38 AM UTC

ribit wrote: post #286

victor9000 wrote: post #254

This device is seriously the answer to all my laptop problems. I really like the form factor of the XPS 13, but now I'm stuck with the complete inability to upgrade RAM. In what universe is that normal? Then I accidentally nuked the USB-C ports on the left side when it got wet, and now I'm left with a single port for everything, including charging. What!? Why? I tore the entire thing apart and there's just no way to…

> In what universe is that normal? In a universe where you want high-performance energy efficient RAM. Premium ultracompact laptops have long moved to LPDDR which is both faster and consumes significantly less energy than regular modular DDR. And LPDDR does not come in DIMMs. And then you have Apple who are using custom package technology with custom RAM chips to cut down RAM power consumption to under one watt activ…

Why is it that you can't have this with socketed RAM? Is there a physical limitation?

Re: The Framework Laptop is now shipping

#303

Post by adminscoffee » Fri, Jul 23, 2021, 8:39 AM UTC

if it produces less waste in the end, i am all for it. it's so sad seeing landfills with old electronics in them.

Re: The Framework Laptop is now shipping

#304

Post by oreilles » Fri, Jul 23, 2021, 8:40 AM UTC

nrp wrote: post #131

nitsky wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you considering OLED as well? The Dell XPS has that as an option and it is a serious draw, especially for coders who stare at a mostly-black screen all day.

@pabs3, there is actually a 4:3 13.3" e-ink panel that may be possible to fit, but it would be challenging to interface. On OLED, nothing we can share yet, but there are certainly benefits to OLED panels.

My god, if you can make an e-ink display work it would be an insta-buy for me.

Re: The Framework Laptop is now shipping

#305

Post by kohlerm » Fri, Jul 23, 2021, 8:40 AM UTC

The Gizmodo review is odd. Comparing this to an M1 based Apple Laptop, with regards to battery performance? You could do that for every Intel/AMD laptop and they all will kind of suck. But if you do not want Apple or you need Intel/AMD than it is not really an argument. They also claim it runs hot, but Verge says something different.

Re: The Framework Laptop is now shipping

#306

Post by rarspace01 » Fri, Jul 23, 2021, 8:40 AM UTC

nrp wrote: post #4

Framework Founder here! I am happy to answer any questions on the product.

When can I expect a German Keyboard?

Re: The Framework Laptop is now shipping

#307

Post by raffraffraff » Fri, Jul 23, 2021, 8:40 AM UTC

ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #294

the_biot wrote: post #274

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What a bunch of nonsense. These are tiny laptops, and every bit of space inside is used. Soldering on RAM chips is an obvious optimization to make the laptop thinner. What were you expecting, a DIMM slot that's taller than the actual laptop body?

>What a bunch of nonsense. These are tiny laptops, and every bit of space inside is used. Soldering on RAM chips is an obvious optimization to make the laptop thinner. THIS is nonsense. Dell, HP, Lenovo, even Fujitsu-Siemens have been making thin laptops with upgradable RAM for years now (XPS, X1 Carbon and LIFEBOOK series come to mind). Just recently they abandoned this and moved to soldering everything. The Framewo…

Who's got the balls to disagree with Chuck Norris?

I would usually go for a smaller, lighter laptop (13"). But within that form factor, given choice over trade offs, I would put performance last (any modern system will usually do), size and weight somewhere in the middle, battery life and repairability at the top.

Re: The Framework Laptop is now shipping

#308

Post by occoder » Fri, Jul 23, 2021, 8:44 AM UTC

psankar wrote: post #161

nrp wrote: post #4

Framework Founder here! I am happy to answer any questions on the product.

Please make full sized keys for up and down arrows, with the arrow keys in an inverted T shape. Group function keys in groups of four. Also provide Mac style keyboard if possible with a command key. I use mac keyboard because it is safer on wrists and thumbs. All the best.

Yes please! I second all these requests!

Full-size arrow keys: by adding another column of keys to the right side of the keyboard. That way you get dedicated Home/End/PageUp/PageDown keys as well. See [1].

Grouping function keys: also put a wider gap between Esc and F1, F12 and Delete.

Mac keyboard: that'd be nice! How compatible are they to hackintosh BTW?

[1] https://img.business.com/o/aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuYnVzaW5lc3NuZXdzZ...

Re: The Framework Laptop is now shipping

#309

Post by kybernetikos » Fri, Jul 23, 2021, 8:46 AM UTC

This looks really great, with some good choices for my kind of use - 3:2 screen, 1080 webcam, better than normal travel on the keys, and being able to easily upgrade memory and storage is a big deal.

The reviews seem to be finding concerns with thermals while battery life and overall performance seems pretty so-so.

I expect that battery life and performance could be improved through upgrading in the future, but it seems like thermals might be a difficult problem to fix.

Re: The Framework Laptop is now shipping

#310

Post by michalf6 » Fri, Jul 23, 2021, 8:46 AM UTC

ribit wrote: post #286

victor9000 wrote: post #254

This device is seriously the answer to all my laptop problems. I really like the form factor of the XPS 13, but now I'm stuck with the complete inability to upgrade RAM. In what universe is that normal? Then I accidentally nuked the USB-C ports on the left side when it got wet, and now I'm left with a single port for everything, including charging. What!? Why? I tore the entire thing apart and there's just no way to…

> In what universe is that normal? In a universe where you want high-performance energy efficient RAM. Premium ultracompact laptops have long moved to LPDDR which is both faster and consumes significantly less energy than regular modular DDR. And LPDDR does not come in DIMMs. And then you have Apple who are using custom package technology with custom RAM chips to cut down RAM power consumption to under one watt activ…

I would really prefer that a laptop was just a tiny bit thicker to fit a 100WH battery to compensate for that. My T480 gets 12-16 hours with normal use, I imagine it could easily hit 20 with current processors.