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A YouTube chat about chess got flagged for hate speech

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Re: A YouTube chat about chess got flagged for hate speech

#351

Post by baobabKoodaa »

formerly_proven wrote: post #316
waterhouse wrote: post #301

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hmm? I don't think an algorithm has to give "correct" answers, it just has to be precisely defined. For example, one could say "For this problem, a greedy algorithm yields decent but suboptimal answers." Merriam-Webster online says: "a procedure for solving a mathematical problem (as of finding the greatest common divisor) in a finite number of steps that frequently involves repetition of an operation" and "broadly :…

Algorithms solve problems. Wrong answers are not solutions to (i.e. do not solve) a given problem. Hence, algorithm implies that it provides correct answers within the parameters of the problem.

The definition of algorithm is wider than you think. As your parent poster noted, "greedy algorithms" exist (as do many other algorithms which provide suboptimal answers). You can easily verify this by googling.

Re: A YouTube chat about chess got flagged for hate speech

#352

Post by rowanG077 »

hirundo wrote: post #21

We need a word or phrase for this phenomenon, where we attempt to substitute human pattern recognition with algorithms that just aren't up to the job. Facebook moderation, Tesla Full Self Driving, the War Games movie, arrests for mistaken facial identification. It's becoming an increasingly dystopic force in our lives and will likely get much worse before getting even worse. So it needs a label. Maybe there's a ten s…

It's not like humans are generally better then this. I mean look at the Github master branch fiasco. It had a completely different meaning then master with slavery connotations. Yet the outrage was so large Github changed this name. I'd say this is the same behavior of this algorithm. Seeing a word and getting "triggered" and marking it as toxic even though it has a completely different meaning.

Re: A YouTube chat about chess got flagged for hate speech

#353

Post by skinkestek »

heartbreak wrote: post #208
visarga wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, generations of black chess pieces have been discriminated in the past. We should make sure the black wins just as much as white, let's just use a coin flip to decide who wins ahead of the game.

There is a whole lot of joking dismissal of systemic racism going on in these comments. Are you making the point you intended?

I think you are honest so I'll give you my best explanation:

Many people here, including many black I think are utterly fed up with nonsense.

I am someone who badgered my boss to get him to give a job to the foreign cleaning lady who had the necessary degree (he did give her a job). My Indian colleague came to thank me a few years later for helping them settle in.

And I'd probably step in in a fight to save someone.

But this stupid stuff that has been going on for the last few years? I guess it causes even more grief for everyone.

Re: A YouTube chat about chess got flagged for hate speech

#354

Post by ficiek »

exporectomy wrote: post #182
thoughty wrote: post #16

There was a star trek channel on youtube which got suspended because he called the fictional race Ferengi “greedy”, which they actually are. Got reinstated after a few days. But it’s getting ridiculous now.

I wonder how The Onion gets away with https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q4PC8Luqiws where they suggest visualizing your money related stress as a greedy hook-nosed race of creatures who want to grabble up all your money - and only hire their own kind.

That is really well done, Onion used to be amazing.

Re: A YouTube chat about chess got flagged for hate speech

#355

Post by toxik »

gorwell wrote: post #74
colordrops wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can't tell if sarcasm.

Sometimes people can't tell with Titania McGrath, a masterclass in satire. https://twitter.com/TitaniaMcGrath

You should always be careful with satire, Poe’s law and all. Funny stuff though.

Re: A YouTube chat about chess got flagged for hate speech

#356

Post by voidhorse »

hirundo wrote: post #21

We need a word or phrase for this phenomenon, where we attempt to substitute human pattern recognition with algorithms that just aren't up to the job. Facebook moderation, Tesla Full Self Driving, the War Games movie, arrests for mistaken facial identification. It's becoming an increasingly dystopic force in our lives and will likely get much worse before getting even worse. So it needs a label. Maybe there's a ten s…

The suggested “malgorithms” is probably the best noun form for these algorithms themselves.

As for terminology that captures society’s general over reliance on automation and algorithms to handle things that really ought to have direct human intervention, I like Rouvroy’s “algorithmic governmentality”

Re: A YouTube chat about chess got flagged for hate speech

#357

Post by bonzini »

nicky0 wrote: post #254
bonzini wrote: post #246

Earlier quoted context omitted.

White goes first because black was considered a lucky color. So if black went first it would have double advantage, from being first and from being the lucky color.

I think you just made that up.

No, I didn't: apparently the above was proposed by chess author George Walker. White didn't consistently start first until around 1860.

https://www.chessgames.com/player/george_walker.html?kpage=1

Re: A YouTube chat about chess got flagged for hate speech

#358

Post by hef19898 »

burning_hamster wrote: post #315
laurent92 wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

11 syllables, almost as requested ;) May I suggest “yacht-feet automation”? It focuses on increasing the yacht feet of Zuckerberg, and doesn’t do anything else right?

Jachtverlängerungsautomatisierung ;-) Also 11 sylabels.

Man, German can be such a nice, beautiful language for stuff like that!

Re: A YouTube chat about chess got flagged for hate speech

#359

Post by boublepop »

hyperhopper wrote: post #14
daenz wrote: post #6

I honestly wouldn't be surprised if someone makes the argument that this automated flagging is an indicator that chess's language is inadvertently racially charged. And think about the concept of "white goes first." All it takes is a few viral tweets, and suddenly the game of chess is in the crosshairs.

In my opinion, that might be a sign that the idea of drawing abstract connections between words and concepts, that are several layers of indirection apart, may be going too far. Yeah using language that upsets people is bad, but if you allow enough layers between words and concepts, _everything_ can be argued to be offensive for one reason or another. Or will be soon once something else becomes a hot button issue.

> Yeah using language that upsets people is bad

There are people who get upset about the language used to communicate results of scientific studies proving the efficiency of vaccines against the ongoing pandemic. Kids get upset at the language “No” even when uttered to tell them that they can’t go out and play with a chainsaw, purely for their own protection.

You cannot determine if language or language usage is bad purely from the response of others even if they get extremely upset about it.

Re: A YouTube chat about chess got flagged for hate speech

#360

Post by saalweachter »

BoxOfRain wrote: post #339
hutzlibu wrote: post #249

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of all the suggestions, I like the "Malgorithms" the most. It is catchy, easy to read and probably understandable by normal people as well.

Yeah, it's definitely the most sellable one I've seen. I don't like the implication that it's the algorithm that's malicious rather than the person who wrote the algorithm (no algorithm is inherently malevolent or benevolent in my opinion, it's just an algorithm), but I also know this distinction is completely pointless for the vast majority of people and "malgorithm" gets the gist of what people are getting at acros…

While "malevolent"/"malicious" definitely has a "wicked" connotation, you also see it in words like "maladapted" or "malodorous" which are just "bad" without the "wickedness".
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