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Texans can carry handguns without a license or training starting Sept. 1

texastribune.org

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Re: Texans can carry handguns without a license or training starting Sept. 1

#31

Post by benjohnson »

frereubu wrote: post #22
mehphp wrote: post #6

I thought this was a terrible idea until I realized that other states are already doing it without any problems.

Genuine question: can you elaborate on "without any problems"? As a European I find the level of gun violence in the US to be shocking, so I don't understand why lax gun laws like these are not a problem. The Bill Hicks quote "There's no connection between having a gun and shooting someone with it, and not having a gun and not shooting someone, and if you make one you're a fool and a communist" is perhaps overly simp…

My view as an American:

I trust my sketchy neighbor with a gun much more than I trust the government with a gun.

Re: Texans can carry handguns without a license or training starting Sept. 1

#32

Post by Grakel »

frereubu wrote: post #22
mehphp wrote: post #6

I thought this was a terrible idea until I realized that other states are already doing it without any problems.

Genuine question: can you elaborate on "without any problems"? As a European I find the level of gun violence in the US to be shocking, so I don't understand why lax gun laws like these are not a problem. The Bill Hicks quote "There's no connection between having a gun and shooting someone with it, and not having a gun and not shooting someone, and if you make one you're a fool and a communist" is perhaps overly simp…

There is very little gun violence in the US. What you're seeing is a media problem.

Re: Texans can carry handguns without a license or training starting Sept. 1

#33

Post by procgen »

post_break wrote: post #19

This helps eliminate a victimless crime. The criminals will still carry illegally and this bill actually upgrades the felony for those who are caught carrying who legally could not. Now someone who needs to carry who can't afford the overpriced classes, fingerprints, waiting for the state to mail you a card to give you your rights is gone. A lot of poor people need to carry a gun for protection, and either cant affor…

"A lot of poor people need to carry a gun for protection"

How utterly dystopian.

Re: Texans can carry handguns without a license or training starting Sept. 1

#34

Post by frereubu »

post_break wrote: post #29
frereubu wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Genuine question: can you elaborate on "without any problems"? As a European I find the level of gun violence in the US to be shocking, so I don't understand why lax gun laws like these are not a problem. The Bill Hicks quote "There's no connection between having a gun and shooting someone with it, and not having a gun and not shooting someone, and if you make one you're a fool and a communist" is perhaps overly simp…

States that have passed these laws saw no dramatic increase in shootings, and optional permits actually went up in these states. Everything related to buying, owning, shooting a gun is exactly the same, the only difference is you no longer need to pay $50-400 to carry it on your person, which criminals do for free.

Ah, OK, so "no problem" in the sense that it hasn't made things any worse. Fair enough.

Re: Texans can carry handguns without a license or training starting Sept. 1

#35

Post by post_break »

procgen wrote: post #33
post_break wrote: post #19

This helps eliminate a victimless crime. The criminals will still carry illegally and this bill actually upgrades the felony for those who are caught carrying who legally could not. Now someone who needs to carry who can't afford the overpriced classes, fingerprints, waiting for the state to mail you a card to give you your rights is gone. A lot of poor people need to carry a gun for protection, and either cant affor…

"A lot of poor people need to carry a gun for protection" How utterly dystopian.

It's true though and has always been the case. Working odd hours not the usual 8-5, might not have a car so walking to work sometimes at night, living in heavy crime areas because it's affordable. I'm not projecting, just calling it like it is and why this bill is a good thing in the eyes of the people who don't even consider this sane.

Re: Texans can carry handguns without a license or training starting Sept. 1

#36

Post by frereubu »

benjohnson wrote: post #31
frereubu wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Genuine question: can you elaborate on "without any problems"? As a European I find the level of gun violence in the US to be shocking, so I don't understand why lax gun laws like these are not a problem. The Bill Hicks quote "There's no connection between having a gun and shooting someone with it, and not having a gun and not shooting someone, and if you make one you're a fool and a communist" is perhaps overly simp…

My view as an American: I trust my sketchy neighbor with a gun much more than I trust the government with a gun.

But your government does have guns, don't they?

Re: Texans can carry handguns without a license or training starting Sept. 1

#37

Post by kryogen1c »

frereubu wrote: post #22
mehphp wrote: post #6

I thought this was a terrible idea until I realized that other states are already doing it without any problems.

Genuine question: can you elaborate on "without any problems"? As a European I find the level of gun violence in the US to be shocking, so I don't understand why lax gun laws like these are not a problem. The Bill Hicks quote "There's no connection between having a gun and shooting someone with it, and not having a gun and not shooting someone, and if you make one you're a fool and a communist" is perhaps overly simp…

> As a European I find the level of gun violence in the US to be shocking

this is probably a perception problem. the uk doesnt have guns but has much higher violent crime with knives. in some ways, stabbing is much more violent and interpersonally malicious than pulling a trigger. there is a very close prevalence of violent crime per capita in US and UK, its just that stab wounds are easier to trest than gunshots.

the US has above average gun violence per capita, but acting like its some widespread danger is largely a construction of fear-driven media and sensationalism. most of US gun violence numbers come from highly localized pockets like detroit, LA, and chicago. its not a problem in almost all of America.

Re: Texans can carry handguns without a license or training starting Sept. 1

#38

Post by procgen »

post_break wrote: post #35
procgen wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"A lot of poor people need to carry a gun for protection" How utterly dystopian.

It's true though and has always been the case. Working odd hours not the usual 8-5, might not have a car so walking to work sometimes at night, living in heavy crime areas because it's affordable. I'm not projecting, just calling it like it is and why this bill is a good thing in the eyes of the people who don't even consider this sane.

A gun wants to be used. Let's let it simmer a few more decades and see what happens.

Re: Texans can carry handguns without a license or training starting Sept. 1

#39

Post by chmod600 »

herodotus wrote: post #14
mehphp wrote: post #6

I thought this was a terrible idea until I realized that other states are already doing it without any problems.

No problems? Look at the science. https://www.pnas.org/content/117/26/14906 "In a hypothetical situation in which there are 39,000 firearms deaths nationally under the permissive combination of these three laws, we expect 4,475 (80% CI, 1,761 to 6,949) more deaths nationally than under the restrictive combination of these laws."

For a study like this, I would expect some connection between the mechanisms and the results. For instance, if carrying laws are changed, is there an associated change in the types of deaths that could plausibly be attributed to that (i.e. lawful carriers shooting people)?

Re: Texans can carry handguns without a license or training starting Sept. 1

#40

Post by Grakel »

frob wrote: post #15
Grakel wrote: post #7

Congratulations to Texas for joining the more than 20 states respecting both the natural right to arms and the Constitution's regulation on government interference with it. I wish they had enumerated many more specific rights not to infringe, but some of the most violated today were considered too obvious to merit specific attention. We're seeing a huge surge for protecting gun rights on the local and state levels, n…

I'm curious to know which additional rights you want to be granted.

Well the Bill of Rights doesn't grant rights. It's a list of things the government can't do. I would start with stopping them from restricting property at all. Much less guns. Behavior should be regulated, not inanimate objects.
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