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Master’s degrees are the second biggest scam in higher education?

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Re: Master’s degrees are the second biggest scam in higher education?

#151

Post by markus_zhang »

kaiwen1 wrote: post #96

I wonder if this scam also applies to executive MBA programs? For example, the Kellogg-HKSTU program cost US$220,000 for about 18 long weekends of on-site classroom time. This is exorbitant, but the Financial Times has ranked the program as the best EMBA program in the world 10 times, primarily due to the large increase in salary after graduation, up 67% to $528,057 in 2020. [1]. In fact, the reported salary increase…

MBA are mostly for connections and maybe an advanced degree (in some countries it's considered as equivalent to a Master's degree and salaries adjust for that especially for government positions). Occasionally, if not sponsored by companies, they serve as a convenient place to find a proper mating partner.

Re: Master’s degrees are the second biggest scam in higher education?

#152

Post by agumonkey »

henrikeh wrote: post #50
agumonkey wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is that recognized socially ? As in opening a business after passes these classes.

My impression, knowing very few who has attended højskole, is that people do it for their own personal fulfillment and enjoyment. Socially, I’d say that it is respected and regarded as a sign of dedication to ones interests.

which is pretty cool, I think it's a vital need for humans to keep learning new stuff if you don't have enough stimulation

Re: Master’s degrees are the second biggest scam in higher education?

#153

Post by ghaff »

maccard wrote: post #139
sys_64738 wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Most masters classes are simply just repackaged versions of undergraduate classes, maybe with a little more depth. Depends on the country. Masters degrees can be research which are the first year of a Ph.D. or they can be taught degrees. In the latter they are usually called "conversion" courses where there's intensive focus on filling in gaps in education for somebody moving to the field. E.g. moving from an Econo…

I did a hybrid masters in CS - half the year was taught and half the year was research. Of the 6 classes I was taught 2 of them were undergrad level (and they were 3rd/final year level at that), and the rest were definitely a level above undergrad. Most were actively learning about the state of the art in their areas, or very close to it. Of the 15 or so students, 5 of us had our names on papers from the research we…

And ones that are solely or mostly classroom courses can even be taken by people who majored in the field undergrad. I know someone who did one years ago at a top school. Which surprised me a bit at the time because, although I did have classes in my Master's program, the real value was in my thesis, some additional related research, and an unrelated project.

Re: Master’s degrees are the second biggest scam in higher education?

#154

Post by ghufran_syed »

dragonwriter wrote: post #126
hallway_monitor wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, having government involved always creates inflation. It's no coincidence that the two areas with most government involvement, education and health care, are the things that have outpaced every other measure of inflation significantly.

> Yes, having government involved always creates inflation. No it doesn't. > It's no coincidence that the two areas with most government involvement, education and health care, are the things that have outpaced every other measure of inflation significantly. The government is less (EDIT: more ) involved (proportionate to total expenditures in the domain) in healthcare lots of places outside the US without equal, much…

It sounds like you’re saying that places with less government involvement have less healthcare inflation - isn’t what the comment you are replying to is arguing?

Re: Master’s degrees are the second biggest scam in higher education?

#155

Post by markus_zhang »

fallingknife wrote: post #17

When are we going to learn that encouraging everyone to get more education is a waste of resources? All it leads to is lowered standards and devalued degrees. Your credential is only worth something because someone else doesn't have it.

I think it's never a waste to get more education. But getting an advanced degree from a mediocre school for the sake of career advancement probably doesn't worth it.

A few exceptions:

1) You want to learn something but doesn't want to go through the 90-credit undergraduate. In my university they give you access to a CS graduate diploma that consists of 10 core CS courses under the requirement that you already have an undergraduate degree (non-CS) and pass the entry CS course about programming (usually a Java 101 course). IMO it's a LOT better than a 90-credit second undergraduate degree on CS.

The other exception is that you want to do the research but I'd argue it still doesn't worth it unless it's a prestigious school like top 20 in North America (MIT, Stanford, CMU, Waterloo, those top schools).

Re: Master’s degrees are the second biggest scam in higher education?

#156

Post by BlissWaves »

arpinum wrote: post #95

At at top 10 school in the UK: masters and even doctorates are being essentially sold to foreign students. The standards are incredibly low (students getting degrees without functional use of English), but the revenue to the university is essential. There is a business risk if schools try to maintain standards (students have paid for degrees, not learning), but the cumulative effect is that I completely ignore gradua…

In engineering?

Re: Master’s degrees are the second biggest scam in higher education?

#157

Post by markus_zhang »

arpinum wrote: post #95

At at top 10 school in the UK: masters and even doctorates are being essentially sold to foreign students. The standards are incredibly low (students getting degrees without functional use of English), but the revenue to the university is essential. There is a business risk if schools try to maintain standards (students have paid for degrees, not learning), but the cumulative effect is that I completely ignore gradua…

This reminds me an episode of Yes Minister but I didn't expect it to go down that fast. Is it the same for STEM as well?

Re: Master’s degrees are the second biggest scam in higher education?

#159

Post by onlyrealcuzzo »

phsource wrote: post #150

One reason that often gets glossed over (including in this article) is how (non-online) Masters programs are huge moneymakers as a ticket to working in the US. I've seen that in CS programs at University of Buffalo and Yale, a majority of Masters students are from abroad, especially from Asia. Basically, if you wanted to work in tech in the US, you could either: - Find a multinational company in your home country, wo…

Assuming you're actually smart and skilled - wouldn't it be better to just start your own consulting business, or if you're really ambitious, eventually an agency?

Aren't H1-B visa workers mostly in extremely HCOL areas and significantly underpaid / taken advantage of?

I imagine if you're from India and you really want to get out of India - this sounds like a good deal (although wouldn't $50k for tuition be hard to get?) But, I'm assuming most people just want to have more money / a better life?

Wouldn't the first option be better? And then you could stay closer to friends and family.

Re: Master’s degrees are the second biggest scam in higher education?

#160

Post by thegginthesky »

CalChris wrote: post #135
sys_64738 wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Most masters classes are simply just repackaged versions of undergraduate classes, maybe with a little more depth. Depends on the country. Masters degrees can be research which are the first year of a Ph.D. or they can be taught degrees. In the latter they are usually called "conversion" courses where there's intensive focus on filling in gaps in education for somebody moving to the field. E.g. moving from an Econo…

In the US, those gaps are usually noted and you fill them with upper division courses and if necessary, lower division. Actual graduate courses are quite different from undergraduate even covering the same subject matter. Lower division is problem sets. Upper division is problem sets + project. Graduate is project + research paper.

I understand GP's point, education can vary widely depending on the country.

For example, in my home country an undergraduate degree in engineering is normally 5 years where

- first 2 years are very standard undergraduate courses (your lower division)

- last 3rd and 4th years are the upper division you describe

- 5th year is a graduation project that can be 50 to 100 pages long (almost a thesis) + upper division courses and maybe a research paper (depends if you had a scholarship of sorts)

So when a person goes to do a master in this country, the experience is almost one of a PhD, while the PhD experience is very intense.

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