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Facebook users said no to tracking, and now advertisers are panicking

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Re: Facebook users said no to tracking, and now advertisers are panicking

#161

Post by als0 »

rascul wrote: post #131
makecheck wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is not destroying the whole concept of ads, it is only pushing back against awful variants. It is definitely possible to have “nice” ads, like simple text or images, with no creepy or CPU-draining elements in them. Nothing is preventing those ads from supporting free services.

I vaguely recall that Google used to use text ads. Not sure if they still do, or if I recall correctly.

From a Google search I made in the last hour, the top 6 search results were all text ads.

Re: Facebook users said no to tracking, and now advertisers are panicking

#162

Post by permo-w »

_zzaw wrote: post #67

If people opt out of what you're doing to them as soon as they're made aware you're doing it, then perhaps that's a sign that you shouldn't have been doing it in the first place. I don't even believe that 25% of users actually wanted tracking. I think a lot of people just blindly tap buttons to make annoyances go away, and these guys just hit the wrong button.

It isn’t clear, but I think the 25% just haven’t downloaded the update yet

Re: Facebook users said no to tracking, and now advertisers are panicking

#163

Post by wintermutestwin »

It would be great if someone created a non-profit simple website for sharing pictures and updates with family and friends. EFF could promote it and all the smart people who hate FB could volunteer to build it. I'd donate buckets of $ to it to stick it to FB and show the world that the current model of surveillance capitalism is not the only way.

Re: Facebook users said no to tracking, and now advertisers are panicking

#164

Post by permo-w »

EamonnMR wrote: post #83
_zzaw wrote: post #67

If people opt out of what you're doing to them as soon as they're made aware you're doing it, then perhaps that's a sign that you shouldn't have been doing it in the first place. I don't even believe that 25% of users actually wanted tracking. I think a lot of people just blindly tap buttons to make annoyances go away, and these guys just hit the wrong button.

Almost all "consent" to these types of "services" is obtained via people blindly tapping buttons to make annoyances go away.

it’s almost funny, but more sick, considering the connotations that the word “consent” carries these days

Re: Facebook users said no to tracking, and now advertisers are panicking

#165

Post by janpot »

Often I hear the argument, people saying "I prefer ads that are relevant for me over random ads". But the result of the tracking is not only that you get "relevant" ads, it's that your timelines and your feeds and your news gets tweaked in ways that makes you engage with ads as much as possible.

Not only do you get manipulated in buying stuff you didn't ask for (ads in general). You're also getting spoonfed content that tries to make you as vulnerable as possible to this manipulation. Up to a point that this is downright threatening democracy and our way of life.

I guess you could call this a form of censorship. Content gets suppressed, simply because it doesn't generate enough ad revenue. It's this type of censorship on "social" media that I consider much more harmful than the type that usually gets most of our attention.

Re: Facebook users said no to tracking, and now advertisers are panicking

#166

Post by fullstop »

Workaccount2 wrote: post #127
cheschire wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If subscriptions were always as easy to manage in one place like they are on an iPhone, I would have absolutely no problem with 20 subscriptions. Where’s the subscription management startup model?

I've thought about this a lot, but the stumbling block for me is getting services onboard. The problem is that subscription services make billions annually on forgotten subscriptions. None of them want an easy "disable" slider next to their name in a convenient app. It also makes à la carte subing easy, where you sub for a month every few months to "catch up". Basically, good luck getting an API with an easy unsubscr…

> where you sub for a month every few months to "catch up".

Make introductory rates low and let people lock in. If they unsub and then resub they will have to do so at a higher rate.

Re: Facebook users said no to tracking, and now advertisers are panicking

#167

Post by alkonaut »

aviraldg wrote: post #94
_zzaw wrote: post #67

If people opt out of what you're doing to them as soon as they're made aware you're doing it, then perhaps that's a sign that you shouldn't have been doing it in the first place. I don't even believe that 25% of users actually wanted tracking. I think a lot of people just blindly tap buttons to make annoyances go away, and these guys just hit the wrong button.

As soon as ad supported free services start shutting down because of ad blocking and lowered clickthrough rates on ads because of targeting being blocked, most people will probably start changing their minds. (The alternative being maintaining 10-20+ paid subscriptions.) For now, all this change means is that users who are opted-in to tracking are subsidising those who aren't.

If sites can’t fund their content with ads based information I’m willing to give up, then they can beg me for money, or charge for the content, or beg me to look at ads or whatever. But I want that transaction to be transparent and deliberate. And I don’t care if 90% of content online just disappears because we click the privacy button. Then it was never a viable business model to begin with.

Re: Facebook users said no to tracking, and now advertisers are panicking

#168

Post by JKCalhoun »

aviraldg wrote: post #94
_zzaw wrote: post #67

If people opt out of what you're doing to them as soon as they're made aware you're doing it, then perhaps that's a sign that you shouldn't have been doing it in the first place. I don't even believe that 25% of users actually wanted tracking. I think a lot of people just blindly tap buttons to make annoyances go away, and these guys just hit the wrong button.

As soon as ad supported free services start shutting down because of ad blocking and lowered clickthrough rates on ads because of targeting being blocked, most people will probably start changing their minds. (The alternative being maintaining 10-20+ paid subscriptions.) For now, all this change means is that users who are opted-in to tracking are subsidising those who aren't.

I don't know. I think when ad supported free services start shutting down people will move on with their lives. We'll find out instead how really unimportant Facebook, etc. was in people's lives. Put another way, how on earth did people get along without Facebook before there was a Facebook?

I'm reminded of a comment from the guy that created the TV-B-Gone. He would turn off TV's in public places like self-service laundromats, etc. He said he was surprised by the general reaction of those that had just recently been transfixed by the flickering 60Hz cathode glow. Mostly they just turned away form the TV and went back to quiet thoughts or whatever.

It was like the TV could go away and people would be like, "okay".

Re: Facebook users said no to tracking, and now advertisers are panicking

#169

Post by abruzzi »

_zzaw wrote: post #135
aviraldg wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As soon as ad supported free services start shutting down because of ad blocking and lowered clickthrough rates on ads because of targeting being blocked, most people will probably start changing their minds. (The alternative being maintaining 10-20+ paid subscriptions.) For now, all this change means is that users who are opted-in to tracking are subsidising those who aren't.

Or these ad companies could come up with ways of making money that people don't want to block. I despise ads, and generally approve of anything that makes ad companies sweat, but it didn't have to be that way. We are where we are because those ad companies have a sociopathically disrespectful attitude towards the people whose attention they need. With tactics like auto-playing videos, popovers, animated ads, and hide…

This sums up my thoughts perfectly. I would add a comment--all of the anti-apple voices in the article talk only about the poor business that will be hurt. The never talk about the benefit or drawback to the people being tracked. Their approach can be summed up as "we have a right to this data and telling people about our tracking and asking if it is alright with them is not alright." So businesses have rights but individuals don't.

Personally, I hope things like this start to kill off the "free internet." I'd much rather pay for the things that I use.

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