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“Cat Person” and Me

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Re: “Cat Person” and Me

#161

Post by watwut »

zozbot234 wrote: post #156
watwut wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

#meetoo was mostly about workplace harassement and then abuse. If you dont want it mix with genaral relationship issues, dont bring that up in that context. Like, dont bring up #meetoo if you want diascuss non abusive relationship. Dont bring non abusive relationships when someone talks about own abuse.

> harassement and then abuse. If you dont want it mix with genaral relationship issues, dont bring that up in that context. This entire thread is about a lady who did just that. (After all, at the very least, the short story's anti-hero is being verbally abusive in his last-mentioned text message to the protagonist.)

How is fiction written as fiction #meetoo or actual relationship? It is neither.

And if you mean the other article, that is about good relationship.

Re: “Cat Person” and Me

#162

Post by schwartzworld »

I read the story a couple of years ago in a writing class and remember being shocked at the main character's actions. The guy in the story was so 2-dimensional and cringy, and I couldn't understand why she would sleep with him. It doesn't surprise me to hear that the real guy wasn't so awful.

Re: “Cat Person” and Me

#163

Post by adjkant »

throwaway675309 wrote: post #149
adjkant wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> greater potential or likelihood of abuse or any degree of taking advantage of people. It seems like this is the core of the disagreement. The factors here are complex, but here are some things I would point to as a starting point: - You often have large financial differences that can start completely accidental power imbalances in otherwise healthy relationships if not managed closely. This can happen regardless of…

This sounds like the kind of neurotically self imposed stratification that could lead to socioeconomic and cultural segregation for dating circles.

> Is it a hard and fast rule? No.

Nowhere did I say to apply any of this as a rule. Literally all this is for is the potential for power imbalances. Plenty of relationships have a mix of these factors and can be healthy. I tried to make this clear but to say it plainly, none of this is proscriptive or prohibitive.

Re: “Cat Person” and Me

#164

Post by adjkant »

AdrianB1 wrote: post #100
adjkant wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> greater potential or likelihood of abuse or any degree of taking advantage of people. It seems like this is the core of the disagreement. The factors here are complex, but here are some things I would point to as a starting point: - You often have large financial differences that can start completely accidental power imbalances in otherwise healthy relationships if not managed closely. This can happen regardless of…

The brain development difference is not a valid argument: even at 18 a person has the same right to vote like a 60 years old one. If you let 18 year old people decide the fate of the society, they should be more than fully capable of deciding for themselves or the voting age is terribly wrong.

1. You're applying my statistical factor at the individual level re brain development. It's a risk factor, not any sort of rule.*

2. I didn't say anywhere the 18 year old can't decide for themselves. This is not me saying "all 18 year olds dating 25 year olds should break up". I am saying that those relationships are more ripe for abuse and they warrant more reflecting/examining for the health of all involved.

* I think my "I avoid these flags" was taken to mean every one individually when I meant the sum of all when it comes to age and life stage gaps, so sorry for the lack of clarity there.

Re: “Cat Person” and Me

#165

Post by adjkant »

GeoAtreides wrote: post #85
adjkant wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> greater potential or likelihood of abuse or any degree of taking advantage of people. It seems like this is the core of the disagreement. The factors here are complex, but here are some things I would point to as a starting point: - You often have large financial differences that can start completely accidental power imbalances in otherwise healthy relationships if not managed closely. This can happen regardless of…

> large financial differences I'm wondering, are you against dating outside one's social class, too? should millionaires date waitresses? or billionaires date millionaires? Doctors dating house cleaners? >Brain development How about dating outside one's education, so to say. Is it ok for a college graduate to date a highschool dropout? How about a well-educated, cultured, person dating a trailer park educated person?…

I am not against dating someone even of a different income level, let alone social class, I think my "I avoid these flags" was taken to mean every one individually when I meant the sum of all when it comes to age gaps, so sorry for the lack of clarity there. But if you do have a strong financial difference, it is something I think people should be aware of as a potential imbalance.

We don't need to get silly with millionaires vs billionaires or reductive stereotyping. Every situation is different and nuanced, and literally all I have said is:

1. Large age/life stage gaps create more statistical vectors for abuse

2. It's worth reflecting on how these factors affect relationships in order to make them as healthy as possible.

Re: “Cat Person” and Me

#166

Post by prvc »

tptacek wrote: post #46
prvc wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"All true your honor, but I said the word fiction beforehand!"

If what you said ran in the fiction section of the New Yorker , that would indeed be a very strong defense against a defamation claim.

Fiction uses false statements about reality in order to (attempt to) describe a deeper truth. Cat Person uses true factual details (in addition to false ones) in order to concoct a lie. In that sense, it is the opposite of our usual notion of fiction.

Re: “Cat Person” and Me

#167

Post by hardwaresofton »

dang wrote: post #18
hardwaresofton wrote: post #6

This was a good read but I was struck with something else… has anyone noticed on long form content the scrollbar being “stuck” at around 85% and never moving after a while? Is this a hack to keep people reading? Am I imagining it?

" Please don't complain about website formatting, back-button breakage, and similar annoyances. They're too common to be interesting. Exception: when the author is present. Then friendly feedback might be helpful. " https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Apologies! Will not do that in the future

Re: “Cat Person” and Me

#168

Post by [deleted] »

kerkeslager wrote: post #147
DoreenMichele wrote: post #56

To me, the most disturbing part of this is the following section: I made plans to rent an apartment with some girls from my econ class the following year, but they told me they’d changed their minds when they found out about my older boyfriend. I'm a woman and I blog. I have made a stab at writing fiction, often loosely based on my life. People tend to assume it is 100 percent true . When I was getting divorced, if I…

> Although I absolutely support things like #MeToo -- support the idea that women should not be silenced about the bad things that have actually happened to them -- I am disturbed and concerned by the general trend that the world seems to think all heterosexual relationships are inherently abusive or something. We hear a great deal about the bad, the things gone wrong, the dark side and sometimes it seems like there…

[deleted]

Re: “Cat Person” and Me

#169

Post by tptacek »

prvc wrote: post #166
tptacek wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If what you said ran in the fiction section of the New Yorker , that would indeed be a very strong defense against a defamation claim.

Fiction uses false statements about reality in order to (attempt to) describe a deeper truth. Cat Person uses true factual details (in addition to false ones) in order to concoct a lie. In that sense, it is the opposite of our usual notion of fiction.

I think this is one of those things that sounds clever and sort of seems like it must make sense, but on closer inspection doesn't hold together at all. As you yourself pointed out on this thread, the history of story writers incorporating the stories of real people into their work goes back centuries. Nor can a work of fiction "concoct a lie", at least beyond the sense that all fiction is a lie.

I think this is one of those threads where we're all trying to reason axiomatically about what fiction is, and it's taking us to some very weird nerd-alternate-reality places. We can just approach the problem empirically; in the 20th century alone, there are dozens of fiction writers who are famous for doing what the author of Cat Person did.

Re: “Cat Person” and Me

#170

Post by dang »

hardwaresofton wrote: post #167
dang wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

" Please don't complain about website formatting, back-button breakage, and similar annoyances. They're too common to be interesting. Exception: when the author is present. Then friendly feedback might be helpful. " https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Apologies! Will not do that in the future

Appreciated!
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