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Introverts didn't 'win' lockdown

bbc.com

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Re: Introverts didn't 'win' lockdown

#81

Post by cpuguy83 »

kristofferR wrote: post #28
tboyd47 wrote: post #20

There aren’t any measurable elements of personality that are fixed. Personality changes as you age. I’ve witnessed a reversal in each of the Myers-Briggs markers in the past 15 years (from INTJ to ESFP) — not intentionally, but that’s just the way my life played out. I’ve come to see the truth of the matter like this: every human being has a need for socializing, but it takes effort and is exhausting. The amount of e…

Agree! One of the most harmful beliefs about the concept of intro-/extroversion is that it is something you are and not something you do. Many people limit themselves massively because of how they've labeled themselves. Especially in "strong introverts", the label is often used as a convenient excuse for not going through the often painful process of trying to improve their confidence skills and social skills. "I'm a…

Your lived experience is not anything like any other human on this planet. I would not presume to know what other people experience or discount their perception of, particularly of themselves and what makes them feel good or feel bad.

Re: Introverts didn't 'win' lockdown

#82

Post by em-bee »

johnchristopher wrote: post #52
hirundo wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have daily human contact online at work. I've never met one of my coworkers in the flesh. In meatspace, I drive into a tiny village once a week to get mail at the post office, usually talking to nobody. Every other week I go to a more distant small town and hit the grocery and hardware store, and pass a few words with a clerk or three. It isn't unusual for a month to go by without speaking in the flesh with anyone…

> Then the loneliness becomes unbearable and I retreat. I don't understand how this goes. Could you describe your experience with more details ? > I built a desk a couple of years ago and I'm still waiting to show it off to somebody. Well, you could paste a picture here :).

when you are alone, you are alone, but when you are among people that you don't know how to interact with, or don't want to interact with because you don't feel you have anything in common with them, then you feel lonely.

Re: Introverts didn't 'win' lockdown

#83

Post by kristofferR »

erikerikson wrote: post #69
kristofferR wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agree! One of the most harmful beliefs about the concept of intro-/extroversion is that it is something you are and not something you do. Many people limit themselves massively because of how they've labeled themselves. Especially in "strong introverts", the label is often used as a convenient excuse for not going through the often painful process of trying to improve their confidence skills and social skills. "I'm a…

This feels brutal and mean to read. It seems that you're telling me my feelings, preferences, and way of being are invalid. Not only that but that I deserve what I've experienced because I have not overlaid my sincere core with the model proposed to me. The world is often structured to heavily advantage highly social individuals. You're right that being less social or even asocial can bear a large accumulative cost.…

You seem overly attached to the label of being an introvert. The whole post is slightly confusing to me in fact.

If you've concluded that other things than increasing social skills are more worthwhile pursuits for you in your life, then that's great. You do you. However, you can't then also complain in the next breath about what your lack of social skills, that you won't spend an effort acquiring, exclude you from.

"Still, many of us live in our ways because we've followed our feelings and sensations." is slightly problematic in my view. The hardest things to change are the one that conflicts with feelings. It doesn't feel good to start exercising it you are overweight for example. Socializing with low social skills and confidence doesn't feel good either. I'd argue that both are worthwhile efforts, even though we need to combat our feelings and fears in order to do it.

Again, if you're totally happy right now that's awesome! Just don't let "I'm an introvert" be your "I'm big-boned" type of excuse for not changing anything if something could be improved by change.

Re: Introverts didn't 'win' lockdown

#84

Post by emerged »

hirundo wrote: post #39
dannyw wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd like to hear more about your life experience - how much human contact do you have on a weekly basis?

I have daily human contact online at work. I've never met one of my coworkers in the flesh. In meatspace, I drive into a tiny village once a week to get mail at the post office, usually talking to nobody. Every other week I go to a more distant small town and hit the grocery and hardware store, and pass a few words with a clerk or three. It isn't unusual for a month to go by without speaking in the flesh with anyone…

I’m generally this way too. Life is beautiful in simple solitude. Other people bring with them all manner of drama and complications, which all see completely pointless to me. I like being around people when they aren’t balls of anger, stress, drama. But those people are extremely rare and they tend to also isolate.

Re: Introverts didn't 'win' lockdown

#85

Post by [deleted] »

johnchristopher wrote: post #52
hirundo wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have daily human contact online at work. I've never met one of my coworkers in the flesh. In meatspace, I drive into a tiny village once a week to get mail at the post office, usually talking to nobody. Every other week I go to a more distant small town and hit the grocery and hardware store, and pass a few words with a clerk or three. It isn't unusual for a month to go by without speaking in the flesh with anyone…

> Then the loneliness becomes unbearable and I retreat. I don't understand how this goes. Could you describe your experience with more details ? > I built a desk a couple of years ago and I'm still waiting to show it off to somebody. Well, you could paste a picture here :).

[deleted]

Re: Introverts didn't 'win' lockdown

#86

Post by hirundo »

em-bee wrote: post #82
johnchristopher wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Then the loneliness becomes unbearable and I retreat. I don't understand how this goes. Could you describe your experience with more details ? > I built a desk a couple of years ago and I'm still waiting to show it off to somebody. Well, you could paste a picture here :).

when you are alone, you are alone, but when you are among people that you don't know how to interact with, or don't want to interact with because you don't feel you have anything in common with them, then you feel lonely.

Yes, thank you.

Re: Introverts didn't 'win' lockdown

#87

Post by underseacables »

I live in a rural area and the only people I generally see in a day are my wife and kids. Occasionally a neighbor. Im an introvert in an extroverted job, and so I try to be the extrovert. When the pandemic hit our office did not switch to remote right away but when it did my whole social world collapsed. I spend at least two weeks of every month on the road, and not all the same time. Going back to HQ and seeing people and having lunch with colleagues, that’s my social life in a nutshell. Not being able to do that was soul crushing, and put strain on my wife because now she has to put up with this big beluga all day!

Re: Introverts didn't 'win' lockdown

#88

Post by tvanantwerp »

I'm an introvert and my wife is an extrovert. She definitely struggled more than I did. But even I got to the point where I was cherishing any small opportunity to chat with a stranger.

A couple of months ago, I went to an old friend's wedding and spent several days with new people for the first time in over a year. About one and a half days in, I'd used up all that pent up extroversion and went right back to my normal introverted self.

Re: Introverts didn't 'win' lockdown

#90

Post by C-x_C-f »

tboyd47 wrote: post #20

There aren’t any measurable elements of personality that are fixed. Personality changes as you age. I’ve witnessed a reversal in each of the Myers-Briggs markers in the past 15 years (from INTJ to ESFP) — not intentionally, but that’s just the way my life played out. I’ve come to see the truth of the matter like this: every human being has a need for socializing, but it takes effort and is exhausting. The amount of e…

It's incredible to me how we see NLP models with billions of parameters struggling to act human even on paper, yet somehow many influential people still claim that the Myers-Briggs type indicator can give predictive value to a 4-bit model of human personality.

I get that most people are likely unaware of the measures of complexity involved in these issues, but at the very least I would expect today's intellectual trendsetters to stop giving any further validation to such an obsolete piece of pseudoscience once and for all.

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