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Gibraltar, world’s only airport runway intersecting a road

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Re: Gibraltar, world’s only airport runway intersecting a road

#101

Post by Kiro »

mjmahone17 wrote: post #75
koyote wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> This doesn't seem like that much of a burden to endure. The road in Gibraltar is a main thoroughfare and I believe the only way to get to the Spanish border. Imagine a rail crossing going through the 101 in SF.

Considering Gibraltar has a grand total of 34,000 residents, it’s more similar to a rail crossing splitting Palo Alto. Which is the case. Similarly, probably as many people a day use the Fremont drawbridge in Seattle, which yields to boat traffic. I think this class of example is why people would be surprised so few cars would sometimes block air traffic. Also the 101 has traffic lights in SF, when the freeway turns…

There's much more traffic than the residents. A lot of people work but doesn't live in Gibraltar, a lot of tourists and loads of people crossing the border just to buy cheap cigarettes. There are usually queues outside every cigarette shop. It's complete chaos at the border and nothing like any rail crossing I've ever seen.

Re: Gibraltar, world’s only airport runway intersecting a road

#102

Post by mormegil »

ilamont wrote: post #88

For decades Taiwan has designed sections of its highways to be converted to military runways in the event of an attack by China. Here's a review with photos of a training exercise a few years ago: The [Taiwan] Air Force sent four types of aircraft to participate in the exercise: a F-16V Fighting Falcon, a Mirage 2000-5 multi-role fighter jet, and Taiwan’s own Indigenous Defense Fighter. The jets took off and landed w…

Yeah, in the Czech Republic (or especially the former Czechoslovakia), part of the main D1 highway (Prague-Brno) is designed as an alternate airfield.

Here is a (then-classified) 1980 army documentary about a large exercise on the highway (using MiG-21 and MiG-23 planes): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FDoZGoaG9_w (sorry, Czech only)

Re: Gibraltar, world’s only airport runway intersecting a road

#103

Post by Cocktail »

ilamont wrote: post #88

For decades Taiwan has designed sections of its highways to be converted to military runways in the event of an attack by China. Here's a review with photos of a training exercise a few years ago: The [Taiwan] Air Force sent four types of aircraft to participate in the exercise: a F-16V Fighting Falcon, a Mirage 2000-5 multi-role fighter jet, and Taiwan’s own Indigenous Defense Fighter. The jets took off and landed w…

In Finland there are many roads that are extended and maintained as alternative "airfields", mainly for purposes of national defense but also as emergency landing sites for civilian craft

Re: Gibraltar, world’s only airport runway intersecting a road

#104

Post by redleader55 »

There are quite a few examples in this thread that show there are other runways intersecting a road. To the most interesting to me is the Meiringen military airport, in Switzerland. Plane spotters are often seen at the level crossing taking photos of the landing F18s. There is even a small parking conveniently located near the same level crossing.

Re: Gibraltar, world’s only airport runway intersecting a road

#105

Post by gfaure »

gumby wrote: post #64
olyjohn wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Seattle, we built the light rail down the middle of a main roadway. The train has to stop for red lights to let cars through. It's so backwards, it's ridiculous. Always fun when the train driver notices it late and slams on the brakes.

Light rail with no separation down main roads exists in a lot of places (including San Francisco) as the right of way is already available. In Redwood City there's a freight line that runs down the middle of a residential street with zero grade separation or fencing or anything else. You can drive over it if there's no train on it. Unsurprisingly it's a poor neighborhood.

Whereabouts in RWC? I checked along the rail route and couldn't find any crossing that wasn't grade-separated.

Re: Gibraltar, world’s only airport runway intersecting a road

#106

Post by iggldiggl »

WkndTriathlete wrote: post #63
olyjohn wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Seattle, we built the light rail down the middle of a main roadway. The train has to stop for red lights to let cars through. It's so backwards, it's ridiculous. Always fun when the train driver notices it late and slams on the brakes.

Minneapolis built their light rail right down the middle of a main roadway, and the train does have to stop for red lights, but there is no train conductor because the train is wired into the stoplight system and slows down/stops/accelerates appropriately. The lights have also been re-timed to allow for the train. Works pretty well in my experience.

> but there is no train conductor because the train is wired into the stoplight system and slows down/stops/accelerates appropriately.

???

If you literally mean a conductor, i.e. as per the Wikipedia "a train crew member responsible for operational and safety duties that do not involve actual operation of the train/locomotive" then yes, but then again that's nothing special as local public transport has mostly got rid of conductors for decades already and only a few systems still retain them (like apparently most older North American subway systems). Also it doesn't really have to do anything with how the traffic lights are wired or not.

If on the other hand you do in fact mean a driver, then that would very much surprise me, as automatic operation of light rail systems running in mixed street traffic is still very uncommon to non-existant (as compared to fully segregated subways and subway-like systems, where new systems are commonly automated and older systems are slowly and occasionally being converted to automatic operation), and a cursory search seems to indicate that Minneapolis is no different in that regard, i.e. the trains are in fact still driver-operated.

Re: Gibraltar, world’s only airport runway intersecting a road

#107

Post by raynr »

peterlk wrote: post #91
ilamont wrote: post #88

For decades Taiwan has designed sections of its highways to be converted to military runways in the event of an attack by China. Here's a review with photos of a training exercise a few years ago: The [Taiwan] Air Force sent four types of aircraft to participate in the exercise: a F-16V Fighting Falcon, a Mirage 2000-5 multi-role fighter jet, and Taiwan’s own Indigenous Defense Fighter. The jets took off and landed w…

A taxi driver in Singapore told me that the highway in Singapore is also designed for planes to land on. My own observations indicated that this was plausible.

If by highway he meant the section of the East Coast Parkway that is straight and wide (the median has potted plants rather than planted trees), my recollection is that this is a myth, that section of the highway may have been intended for planes to land on in an emergency, but no longer. Unfortunately I do not have sources.

But if by highway he meant Lim Chu Kang road, then it's not just plausible: Lim Chu Kang road is actually used as an extra airstrip. The RSAF conducts regular exercises to ensure it can still be used as such, the last one being about 5 years ago [0]. There is an interesting video from 2009 on the subject too [1].

[0] https://www.straitstimes.com/singapore/planes-taking-over-li...

[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CBMD4QTSyqM

Re: Gibraltar, world’s only airport runway intersecting a road

#108

Post by miohtama »

Kiro wrote: post #101
mjmahone17 wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Considering Gibraltar has a grand total of 34,000 residents, it’s more similar to a rail crossing splitting Palo Alto. Which is the case. Similarly, probably as many people a day use the Fremont drawbridge in Seattle, which yields to boat traffic. I think this class of example is why people would be surprised so few cars would sometimes block air traffic. Also the 101 has traffic lights in SF, when the freeway turns…

There's much more traffic than the residents. A lot of people work but doesn't live in Gibraltar, a lot of tourists and loads of people crossing the border just to buy cheap cigarettes. There are usually queues outside every cigarette shop. It's complete chaos at the border and nothing like any rail crossing I've ever seen.

Gibraltar has seen as many as 12M yearly tourists in its prepandemic peak https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tourism_in_Gibraltar

For comparison, New York used to get 66M yearly tourists https://www.nytimes.com/2021/05/13/nyregion/nyc-tourism-covi...

Re: Gibraltar, world’s only airport runway intersecting a road

#109

Post by [deleted] »

saool wrote: post #78
miohtama wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Like Ceuta?

Not only is that a tu quoque fallacy but it also fails to take into account that both Ceuta and Melilla are integral parts of Spain and have been since the 16th century, centuries prior to Morocco's independence from France in 1956, whereas Gibraltar, being a British Overseas Territory, is not and never has been part of the United Kingdom.

[deleted]

Re: Gibraltar, world’s only airport runway intersecting a road

#110

Post by duiker101 »

axiosgunnar wrote: post #23
duiker101 wrote: post #7

I lived next to the runway for about an year. I can actually seem the apartment from some of the photos. It was an interesting place. It's really just after the border with Spain so if you stay in the country you don't need to cross it every day, but more people work in Gib than live so there is quite a good amount of traffic. As with most things, you get used to it and it just becomes normal very quickly. The best t…

Was it not super loud?

You felt it a bit if you left the windows open but I was never woken up in morning. Also, there were no night flights except for the occasional huge military plane.
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