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Indian Official Puts Public Webcam in Government office

nytimes.com

11–20 of 34 posts

Re: Indian Official Puts Public Webcam in Government office

#11
post #2

It's just a trick to boost his "anti corruption" image, I presume. You don't get bribes in the office, in a clear, visible way. It's sent through intermediaries, persons he trust. And even if you want to pay him in the office, which is never done, you could slip the money among papers or in so many ways which are not caught on camera. I don't understand what we should expect to see. A person who offers a big pack of…

You don't get bribes in the office, in a clear, visible way.

This is almost certainly true, especially for major politicos. This is addressed later in the article in this snippet:

Sunil Abraham, the executive director of the Center for Internet and Society in Bangalore, said he applauded Mr. Chandy’s webcams, even if the effort amounted to no more than tokenism.

“This type of tokenism is also quite useful,” said Mr. Abraham, predicting it might check the behavior of not only the chief minister, but also his underlings and the powerful executives and politicians who come to visit him.

Of course, he noted, if people are intent on paying bribes, they could probably still do it outside the office.

Mr. Abraham said webcams might be a far more powerful tool if installed in police stations, drivers’ licenses offices, welfare agencies and other places where Indians interact with officials who sometimes demand bribes to do routine work.

The last paragraph is especially interesting, but it would never fly. There would be widespread opposition on flimsy grounds, and even if it were implemented, the webcams would magically malfunction for no apparent reason.

Every single government-run agency I've been to for any sort of work, or any run-in with the cops - I've paid a bribe.

Drivers' license, certificate of domicile, Certificate of marriage, Passport office, Train ticket inspector, Stopped by cops on road. Each case has its own story about how I was being yanked around by the players in question, and a not-subtle-at-all culmination in how they'd essentially just stick their hands out and say, "You know what to do.".

I would think that a reasonable way to combat this is to just pay these officials well, but I'm not sure that carries any conviction any more. It's a sadly endemic evil that will only be tackled with a widespread name-and-shame campaign (the likes of http://www.ipaidabribe.com).

Re: Indian Official Puts Public Webcam in Government office

#13
A more important step would be to make each and every communication between government officials public on their respective website. A letter written, a order passed, a note on the file. Government officials generally scan and put the documents as PDF which makes it difficult to search.

Re: Indian Official Puts Public Webcam in Government office

#14
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't get the whole point of it. In India, it is known that officials in the government slack during office hours. Delaying of process for unworthy reasons. Numerous time-breaks and other infinite 'small' but aggregatively deterrent forms of behaviours in the office. The camera moves the whole system a step forward. Transparency is more easily perceivable to the public now. The necessity of a sting operation in t…

"In India, it is known that officials in the government slack during office hours." It's been known to happen in North America too. :)

The corruption in India is a bit different. If you need a electricity connection for you home you need to pay a bribe. If you need water connection more bribe. If you want to run a hotel you need to take 375 permission and for each you have to pay a bribe (all these 375 permission need to be renewed every year, well most of them). Even the poorest people who live less than $2 per day have to pay a bribe to get a certificate that says they are poor enabling them to take benefit of various social security schemes.

Re: Indian Official Puts Public Webcam in Government office

#16

A more important step would be to make each and every communication between government officials public on their respective website. A letter written, a order passed, a note on the file. Government officials generally scan and put the documents as PDF which makes it difficult to search.

On top of that, we would also require some kind of automated technology to scan through these public data (reports, documents, videos, etc.) and detect anomalies. Without such automated detection, at the rate any govt. produces data, manual detection would be very slow and it would be improbable to catch corrupt deals.

Re: Indian Official Puts Public Webcam in Government office

#17
post #9

The point is that its not any official but a Chief Minister( akin to Governor in the US) that is doing this. The message that he is putting across to all other Government officials is much more important than us being able to see if he is slacking off or not.

To me the deeper point is that politicians are slowly waking up and responding to the will of the populace that votes them in. This may be a token gesture, but it is a huge step as a tacit admission that voter opinion matters to once-unaccountable officials.

Re: Indian Official Puts Public Webcam in Government office

#18

A more important step would be to make each and every communication between government officials public on their respective website. A letter written, a order passed, a note on the file. Government officials generally scan and put the documents as PDF which makes it difficult to search.

On top of that, we would also require some kind of automated technology to scan through these public data (reports, documents, videos, etc.) and detect anomalies. Without such automated detection, at the rate any govt. produces data, manual detection would be very slow and it would be improbable to catch corrupt deals.

I'm not sure I understand how a program could be made that scans through reports and videos and reports possible instances of corruption, at least without a few huge steps forwards in AI and image processing.

Re: Indian Official Puts Public Webcam in Government office

#19
post #2

It's just a trick to boost his "anti corruption" image, I presume. You don't get bribes in the office, in a clear, visible way. It's sent through intermediaries, persons he trust. And even if you want to pay him in the office, which is never done, you could slip the money among papers or in so many ways which are not caught on camera. I don't understand what we should expect to see. A person who offers a big pack of…

> You don't get bribes in the office, in a clear, visible way.

Actually, you do. Numerous undercover TV news stories like on 60 Minutes, 20/20, and Dateline, as well as police sting operations, show exactly that.

Another huge counterexample to the "you don't get bribes in the office, in a clear, visible way" is the case of Peruvian President's right-hand man, Vladimiro Montesinos, who secretly video-taped himself paying hundreds of MILLIONS in bribes in his office:

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Vladimiro_Montesin...

We are indeed talking about about briefcases full of cash, containing hundreds of thousands of dollars each, and counting them out on a table in his office. Imagine what he would have paid for a product like Deniable Video,

https://deniablevideo.com/

so that he could keep his transactions secret. This is opposite to the Indian official's objective, who wants openness, but my point is that big bribes--at least sometimes--work exactly the way that you say they don't.

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