Challenges in the diagnosis of magnesium status • Hacker News Board

Re: Challenges in the diagnosis of magnesium status

#261

Post by TheSpiceIsLife » Sun, Jun 27, 2021, 11:37 PM UTC

noodlenotes wrote: post #157

esquivalience wrote: post #4

From the source: "The high rate of magnesium deficiency now postulated [5,6,7,8] can be attributed in part to a steady decline in general magnesium content in cultivated fruits and vegetables, a reflection of the observed depletion of magnesium in soil over the past 100 years [11,12,13]. A report to Congress was already sounding the alarm as far back as the 1930s, pointing out the paucity of magnesium, and other mine…

I wonder if there's a relationship to the obesity epidemic, especially since it's not just humans that are getting larger but also lab animals, pets, and wild animals living close to humans [1]. What if we're compelled to eat more calories when we're not getting enough nutrients in our diets? This would impact any animals consuming lower quality fruits and vegetables. [1] https://www.nature.com/articles/news.2010.628

I’ve been saying this since my nutrition lecture said it in 2003, and he’d been saying it for at least two decayed before that.

If you don’t get enough chromium and molybdenum your body can’t properly regular blood glucose control via insulin sensitivity, protein, carbohydrate, and lipid metabolism.

Re: Challenges in the diagnosis of magnesium status

#262

Post by interlocutor » Sun, Jun 27, 2021, 11:38 PM UTC

kossTKR wrote: post #231

interlocutor wrote: post #224

Magnesium solved two problems for me: stiff muscles and insomnia. Scientific information about how magnesium works is hard to come by. Here's what I have been able to gather from various sources: The cells in your body need calcium to go into "on state". To go into "off state" magnesium has to go in and displace calcium. When your body is low on magnesium your muscles can't go into "off state" and your muscles become…

How much magnesium are we talking about here? I actually have magnesium in my supplement drawer : "Magnesium Carbonate from natural sources" - it says take 2 grams, max 4 grams and let it "sit in cold water for 10 minutes, or warmer water for 10 seconds" before drinking. Is that the range you are taking and is the l-threonate form much better, ie. is carbonate useless? Interested in trying this out later this night..

The l-threonate works better for sleep. I take two 50mg tablets per day. In addition I take 400 to 600mg of "magnesium lysinate glycinate chelate" per day to help with muscles.

Re: Challenges in the diagnosis of magnesium status

#263

Post by hinkley » Sun, Jun 27, 2021, 11:38 PM UTC

version_five wrote: post #27

I understand this seems mostly to be about soil depletion. I'm curious more generally if vegetables are also less nutritious because they are selectively bread for high water content and size. For example, its appeared to me for years that you vegetables you get on a Subway sandwich must have almost no nutritional content. They are all way paler than you'd normally see, and super watery. Thinking about it, I suppose…

I recall someone complaining about this at one point. Their model was this:

Most of the nutrients in the fruit come from the plant, not the ground. Since we are breeding for a higher ratio of fruit to plant size (dwarf plants, supersized fruits, sometimes both), there is less to put into the fruit.

Also fungi provide most of the nutrients to plants, and tilling slowly destroys the soil life, leaving mineral soils, in which some nutrients may not be bioavailable.

Re: Challenges in the diagnosis of magnesium status

#264

Post by TheSpiceIsLife » Sun, Jun 27, 2021, 11:40 PM UTC

pembrook wrote: post #233

nerdponx wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anecdotally, this has been my personal experience. I have gone through phases of my life where I ate a lot of junk food. I would feel constantly hungry during those phases, until I ate something nutritious, green and easily-digestible, like steamed broccoli or green peas.

This doesn’t make any scientific sense. Study after study has shown that protein and complex carbs are what reduces feelings of hunger, not vegetables. This makes sense when you consider most green vegetables like broccoli are 90% water. A meat like chicken, after cooking is only about 60% water. So if you eat 400g of broccoli vs 400g of chicken, the one that will make you feel more full is obviously the protein. Wha…

Just quietly, you need to update your knowledge.

Look in to, at the very least, how chromium and molybdenum help regular homeostasis via insulin sensitivity and macronutrient metabolism.

Re: Challenges in the diagnosis of magnesium status

#265

Post by dheera » Sun, Jun 27, 2021, 11:41 PM UTC

esquivalience wrote: post #4

From the source: "The high rate of magnesium deficiency now postulated [5,6,7,8] can be attributed in part to a steady decline in general magnesium content in cultivated fruits and vegetables, a reflection of the observed depletion of magnesium in soil over the past 100 years [11,12,13]. A report to Congress was already sounding the alarm as far back as the 1930s, pointing out the paucity of magnesium, and other mine…

I wonder if that's specific to the US and other western nations.

One thing I've noticed is that vegetables are rather tasteless in the US. Vegetables in Asia are packed with flavor, and maybe they are also packed with nutrients as well?

Re: Challenges in the diagnosis of magnesium status

#266

Post by tharkun__ » Sun, Jun 27, 2021, 11:43 PM UTC

patall wrote: post #148

briefcomment wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Does it need to be whole?

I would actually argue no. Stuff you grow at home is never looking as good as from the store because worms, rain and so on. Strawberries or cherries that have been picked by birds, wasps or slugs are usually fully ripe. Although I agree, whole fruit make it harder to hide bad ones in there

Since I just finished making jam from it let me tell you a secret: bird netting exists. No wasps or slugs in them and mostly no worms.

In this case, sour cherries. Sour cherries are great because almost no worms (only in the variety I have that has the highest sugar content and not many either). The bird netting really helps. Last year no crop, today about 7 pints of jam and I can probably get the same again in a few weeks when the rest ripe s. This is from 3 trees that are about 4 years old now. They're the University of Saskatchewan types (Romeo, Juliet, Crimson passion etc.).

I would say at least 90% of the crop looks saleable. Of course they're sour cherries and they're much smaller than the sweet cherries everyone knows and buys at the store. Other than the bird netting these are completely hands off. No chemicals, completely organic. All they get is compost from all the leaves (the city trucks will not get mine ever!) and guinea pig poop (basically nicely processed grass/hay).

Re: Challenges in the diagnosis of magnesium status

#267

Post by aaron695 » Sun, Jun 27, 2021, 11:44 PM UTC

Even if this was true, which it is not, if you have nutrient deficiencies you need supplements not better food.

In present day Western society if you don't get everything you need, which will be from disease, alcoholism, age, lack of sun or specific diets like Vegan, food cannot accurately help.

Re: Challenges in the diagnosis of magnesium status

#268

Post by layoutIfNeeded » Sun, Jun 27, 2021, 11:45 PM UTC

sabco wrote: post #122

the_lonely_road wrote: post #77

Meta comment on this thread so forgive me. There are only 40 comments and 3 of them are top level comments stating that taking magnesium supplements cured their health issue. One is anxiety, one is sleep issues, and one is migraines. These are some of the same claims I hear from the marijuana enthusiasts on Reddit frequently. I don’t have any points to make about the observation, just noticed it and felt compelled to…

For anyone taking magnesium supplements that have found it helpful, did you ever get a blood test to look at your magnesium levels and did they say you were deficient based on the reference ranges?

You can’t overdose magnesium orally if you have healthy kidneys. The worst that can happen is a bit of diarrhea.

Re: Challenges in the diagnosis of magnesium status

#269

Post by hinkley » Sun, Jun 27, 2021, 11:46 PM UTC

scandox wrote: post #42

And less tasty. One of my in-laws started an organic garden solely to supply a local hotel down the country and she gave us a big box of vegetables when we were leaving after a visit. It was very revealing. Everything she gave us had distinct and powerful tastes that were blatantly lacking from their supermarket equivalents (including the ones that say Organic on the label). The garlic blew my mind: I used the usual…

Lots of foods selected for shelf life.

Used to be mostly winter crops that needed that proviso. To wit: one of the two garlics I grow has a 4 month longer shelf life than the other. The one has to be planted in the fall or you risk losing most of your seed cloves by late spring. The other, I just planted a second crop, from garlic harvested last fall. They were not in awesome shape, but about 80% went in the ground.

Re: Challenges in the diagnosis of magnesium status

#270

Post by SuoDuanDao » Sun, Jun 27, 2021, 11:46 PM UTC

pembrook wrote: post #233

nerdponx wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anecdotally, this has been my personal experience. I have gone through phases of my life where I ate a lot of junk food. I would feel constantly hungry during those phases, until I ate something nutritious, green and easily-digestible, like steamed broccoli or green peas.

This doesn’t make any scientific sense. Study after study has shown that protein and complex carbs are what reduces feelings of hunger, not vegetables. This makes sense when you consider most green vegetables like broccoli are 90% water. A meat like chicken, after cooking is only about 60% water. So if you eat 400g of broccoli vs 400g of chicken, the one that will make you feel more full is obviously the protein. Wha…

Yes, proteins and carbs reduce feelings of hunger. But nutrient deficiencies cause food cravings. That's why people who eat high-calorie meals with few vitamins and minerals tend to overeat, they satiate their hunger but the cravings remain.