Live data from Hacker News

The blackout Palestinians are facing on social media

restofworld.org

221–230 of 325 posts

Re: The blackout Palestinians are facing on social media

#221
post #75
post #21

As a progressive Muslim - I believe both Israel and Palestine have the right to exist, and thrive. Unfortunately, it looks like the state of Israel has now become a needless oppressor and are content building an apartheid state without learning from the past.

As a conservative former Muslim: As long as Palestinians chant “from the river to the sea” and tolerate Hamas any talk about a two state solution is a joke. By not rejecting Hamas, Palestinians make themselves a military problem rather than a civil rights issue. You don’t give civil rights to people who are military threat. This isn’t a point about morality, but the simple reality of nations protecting themselves. If…

I don't disagree with your assessment, though it's not like Israel is perfect either - Israelis have been happy to continually vote for people who don't particularly prioritize peace (to put it mildly), and Israel has basically been strategically strengthening their position in negotiations by building settlements for the past 50 years.

The situation is complicated exactly because there are few ways forward if neither side has any incentives to compromise (partly for real strategic reasons, partly because the people in charge have goals that are not equivalent to making their people better off).

Re: The blackout Palestinians are facing on social media

#222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's almost like maybe you should care and speak out about Palestine and Bengladeshis in Qatar and Rohingya and Yemenis and Uighurs.

That’s not what I’m driving at. My point is that there is a reason Bangladeshis all learn about Israel oppressing Palestine but don’t care about other Bangladeshis being worked to death in the Middle East. There’s a reason that’s the thing that gets people’s attention compared to all the other human rights issues out there.

What do you think that reason is?

Re: The blackout Palestinians are facing on social media

#223
post #20

As an American Jew who grew up with a distorted and racist world view in regard to Palestine this just feels like history repeating itself. The troubles that face Israelis have always been amplified over those of Palestinians in my experience. That control of the narrative led me to be actively racist for most of my life while thinking I was not and also morally superior. This kind of censorship has a body count, and…

> As an American Jew... The troubles that face Israelis have always been amplified over those of Palestinians in my experience.

As an American Jew, what experience do you have of the troubles that face Israelis or Palestinians?

Re: The blackout Palestinians are facing on social media

#224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just want to point out that this nonsense is Islamophobia and should not be tolerated. Muslims are no less people than anyone else. They are not the cartoonish evil character that you believe them to be.

>I just want to point out that this nonsense is Islamophobia and should not be tolerated. Muslims are no less people than anyone else. They are not the cartoonish evil character that you believe them to be. He said progressive. Progressive doesn't mean "not evil", it means progressive. Can you name a single Muslim-majority country that allows gay marriage?

>Can you name a single Muslim-majority country that allows gay marriage?

I think that's a false dichotomy. The question is not if a country is a Muslim-majority country or a Christian-majority country, but if it's secular enough or not.

Re: The blackout Palestinians are facing on social media

#225

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem with peaceful protest is that it can only work if there is very strong international pressure to stop Israel, because they most definitely won't stop by themselves. The problem with expecting any international pressure, is that America vetos any such event, and Israel work really hard to make sure they always have the backing of all the countries that matter. In any case, Hamas's existence is completely o…

All Palestinian violence, especially by Hamas, is used very effectively to gain international sympathy for Israel and to excuse violent & unjust policies. A much greater level of non-violence from the Palestinian side would result in far stronger international pressure, and also domestic American pressure.

> A much greater level of non-violence from the Palestinian side would result in far stronger international pressure, and also domestic American pressure.

The 2018-2019 Gaza border protests (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2018%E2%80%932019_Gaza_border_...) began with extended peaceful demonstrations and dancing by Palestinians. This was met with live fire from Israel, maiming tens of thousands and killing well over 200 people.

There was no meaningful international response, with America only voicing support for Israel's "right to defend itself."

Re: The blackout Palestinians are facing on social media

#226
post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He does not have to care about every injustice every time. But he should not be proud about not caring.

Why not? Who cares? Like he said, this is far from the worst conflict going on right now and it receives a disproportionate amount of interest. I don't care about the conflict in china or in Yemen or in syria. Because I'm a coherent person, I also don't care about what's happening in israel.

Because being proud of lack of empathy and just ... humanity is pretty fucked up?

Re: The blackout Palestinians are facing on social media

#227

I know many users have flagged this because moderator, dang, has turned off the flags for this post. I'm sure it would be off the front page by now if he had not. I also know that after some period of relative peace, the Palestinian people allowed over (conservatively) 3,000 rockets to be fired on Israel by their militias, injuring over (conservatively) 100 and killing 10 (as reported by the Associated Press). To me…

> I also know that after some period of relative peace, the Palestinian people allowed over (conservatively) 3,000 rockets to be fired on Israel by their militias, injuring over (conservatively) 100 and killing 10 (as reported by the Associated Press).

Why, after some period of relative peace, did the Palestinian people suddenly "allow" rockets to be fired on Israel? Were there any proximate causes which they were responding to?

How many missiles did the Israeli people allow to be fired into Palestine? How many Palestinians were injured (conservatively)? How many Palestinians killed?

Re: The blackout Palestinians are facing on social media

#228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In that case Israel should follow New Zealand's example and allow all Palestinians to become citizens, with full rights, stop being an ethnostate for Jews, stop with the racism and start behaving like the progressive country they pretend to be.

And it comes down to it: the logic of progressivism inherently demands the end of Israel because it can’t conscience the notion of an ethnostate.

End of Israel _as an entho-state_, which is not necessarily end of Israel as a state.

If Nazi Germany could turn into regular Germany, one of the most progressive nations on Earth, so can anyone else.

Re: The blackout Palestinians are facing on social media

#229
post #20

As an American Jew who grew up with a distorted and racist world view in regard to Palestine this just feels like history repeating itself. The troubles that face Israelis have always been amplified over those of Palestinians in my experience. That control of the narrative led me to be actively racist for most of my life while thinking I was not and also morally superior. This kind of censorship has a body count, and…

As an Israeli who lives in the Southern part of Israel, and who lived here during the Second Intifada, I think you would change your mind if you walked a mile in my shoes. I think the Israeli-Palestinian conflict has been absorbed by social justice movements in the USA and people apply it to the BLM movement. It just does not fit the same narrative no badly how much Americans and Europeans want it to, but it is terri…

If you sincerely walked a mile in the Palestinian side of your shoes, you would say the complete opposite.
Post reply on HN