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U.S. Commerce Department rescinds TikTok, WeChat prohibited transactions list

reuters.com

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Re: U.S. Commerce Department rescinds TikTok, WeChat prohibited transactions list

#41

Post by elliekelly »

dumb1224 wrote: post #28
pclmulqdq wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Chinese law is extremely hostile to foreign companies, forcing them to give up their IP and have a large operating presence in China (including a political arm of the CCP within the company). No other country is so hostile to foreigners, and international pressure should be applied to get then to change this behavior. It is antithetical to free trade and free markets. It is completely understandable that foreign comp…

> ..have a large operating presence in China (including a political arm of the CCP within the company) I've never heard of this, do you have examples? I'll be happy to read about it. Normally there will be some PR/communication office under marketing sure, but I don't know what a 'political arm' could be.

The NYT’s podcast “The Daily” had a really good episode a few days ago about Apple & China that touches on these sorts of “political” requirements. I think it’s much more subtle (but no less concerning) than parent comment implies.

Episode link (w/ transcript): https://www.nytimes.com/2021/06/14/podcasts/the-daily/apple-...

Re: U.S. Commerce Department rescinds TikTok, WeChat prohibited transactions list

#42

Post by corytheboyd »

Is there tangible, real, honest to god proof that the Chinese government is involved in using TikTok to “steal data”? Because to be honest it sounds like nationalistic nonsense to me.

Classic HN, due pedantry on backing up broad statements with sources, except for when it’s about whatever enemy is currently in the spotlight.

Re: U.S. Commerce Department rescinds TikTok, WeChat prohibited transactions list

#43

Post by llboston »

angio wrote: post #32
nromiun wrote: post #8

> "China has been urging the U.S. side to respect market economy principles and international trade rules, to immediately stop stretching the concept of national security and stop wantonly abusing state power to suppress China's tech companies," spokesman Zhai Lijian said on Tuesday in Beijing. Ironic. I don't suppose they will allow Twitter, Facebook etc in China after this.

Technically the companies are allowed to operate in China, but to do so they would need to follow the strict censorship and data sharing rules the Chinese government requires all companies to adopt. That's why, for example, Bing is available in China and Google not.

> Technically the companies are allowed to operate in China

So you are saying they are not blocked by the GFW?

Re: U.S. Commerce Department rescinds TikTok, WeChat prohibited transactions list

#45

Post by corytheboyd »

CyanBird wrote: post #34
FearlessNebula wrote: post #2

I really can’t stand TikTok. It sucks up so much data straight to the Chinese government, I absolutely refuse to use it. But so many good creators are starting to dabble with it, and many of my friends will send me TikTok links that I can’t open.

> It sucks up so much data straight to the Chinese government Do you have a source for this? At least in the case of the US all user data by law must remain in the country, wouldn't surprise me if the same happened on the entirety of the EU

Seriously, does anyone have anything?

Re: U.S. Commerce Department rescinds TikTok, WeChat prohibited transactions list

#46

Post by lumost »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #29
pclmulqdq wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Chinese law is extremely hostile to foreign companies, forcing them to give up their IP and have a large operating presence in China (including a political arm of the CCP within the company). No other country is so hostile to foreigners, and international pressure should be applied to get then to change this behavior. It is antithetical to free trade and free markets. It is completely understandable that foreign comp…

> Chinese law is extremely hostile to foreign companies, forcing them to give up their IP and have a large operating presence in China (including a political arm of the CCP within the company) Reciprocity legislation isn’t a bad idea. Chinese companies operating in the U.S. must transfer technology to a local affiliate, pay for a DoC agent to be on site, et cetera .

Given how high profile the Chinese trade imbalances are it does make one wonder what other lopsided trade deals the US has outstanding.

Re: U.S. Commerce Department rescinds TikTok, WeChat prohibited transactions list

#47

Post by savant_penguin »

angio wrote: post #32
nromiun wrote: post #8

> "China has been urging the U.S. side to respect market economy principles and international trade rules, to immediately stop stretching the concept of national security and stop wantonly abusing state power to suppress China's tech companies," spokesman Zhai Lijian said on Tuesday in Beijing. Ironic. I don't suppose they will allow Twitter, Facebook etc in China after this.

Technically the companies are allowed to operate in China, but to do so they would need to follow the strict censorship and data sharing rules the Chinese government requires all companies to adopt. That's why, for example, Bing is available in China and Google not.

My impression is that's really just a technicality though. If instead of a total ban imposed on these companies, the US imposed incredibly tough rules tailored for them but that applied to "all" foreigners that made it impossible for these companies to operate, the end result would be the same

Re: U.S. Commerce Department rescinds TikTok, WeChat prohibited transactions list

#48

Post by nirav72 »

hulitu wrote: post #19
Barrin92 wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

there's a difference between the US treating TikTok or WeChat differently even compared to American companies vs the fact that China just has an entirely different legal framework. Facebook or Twitter aren't banned because they're American, they're banned because they're not willing to comply with Chinese law at all, which Chinese companies themselves are subject to . Bing operates in China, as do a bunch of other la…

> there's a difference between the US treating TikTok or WeChat differently even compared to American companies vs the fact that China just has an entirely different legal framework. This is pure propaganda. There is absolutely no difference. Both steal your data, both will cause you trouble at border control ( see obligation to give your phone for searching at US border some years ago).

while I've heard of few incidents of devices being searched..I've never had any such issues where U.S CBP wanted to search my phone or laptop when entering the U.S.

Re: U.S. Commerce Department rescinds TikTok, WeChat prohibited transactions list

#50

Post by LatteLazy »

corytheboyd wrote: post #42

Is there tangible, real, honest to god proof that the Chinese government is involved in using TikTok to “steal data”? Because to be honest it sounds like nationalistic nonsense to me. Classic HN, due pedantry on backing up broad statements with sources, except for when it’s about whatever enemy is currently in the spotlight.

This story [0] covers a report that they worked with the CCP to help with the Geoocide against the Uighurs. That's not exactly what you asked for, but I think it contributed to the deeper point: if you do business in China, you give the CCP what they want.

If that's Uighur's hiding in cellars or a senator's affair before (s)he votes on tariffs or whatever, it doesn't really make a difference.

Don't get me wrong, the NSA are playing the same "game" and have been caught a lot more often.

[0] https://www.smh.com.au/world/asia/tiktok-s-owner-is-helping-...

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