Did Windows 10 slow down with each feature update? • Hacker News Board

Re: Did Windows 10 slow down with each feature update?

#101

Post by 1_player » Mon, Jun 21, 2021, 7:46 PM UTC

Wowfunhappy wrote: post #14

zlynx wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not counting BIOS time it is about 5 seconds to Windows login on my Windows with NVMe systems. It does take about 20 seconds after login for it to finish loading all of the tiny startup notification icons, but that's actually intentional by Windows so it does not overload and prevent you from launching the apps you want. After login I can click on the web browser or email and it will launch instantly for me. If you a…

The point is, why does OP need to spend money on an SSD (and create e-waste in the process) when an HDD used to be reasonably fast for the same task?

HDD have been slow since before Windows 10 was announced. I was converting friends to SSDs during the Windows 7 era. At least on HN I would expect technical-minded people to have some perspective on the speed of storage mediums and how _fast_ and _cheap_ solid state drives are. Yes, I said cheap.

A crappy SSD from a good brand is £70/TB (Samsung 860 QVO), and it is ORDERS (plural) of magnitude faster an a hard disk drive.

You can run whatever you want on antiquated hardware, but please people, stop complaining about it and get on with the times already.

Re: Did Windows 10 slow down with each feature update?

#102

Post by reader_mode » Mon, Jun 21, 2021, 7:47 PM UTC

rkagerer wrote: post #63

reader_mode wrote: post #46

I built a Windows PC after 3 years of using my 15 inch 2018 MBP (which is by far the worst machine I have owned considering the price). Windows has gone to shit, I have visual glitches in the UI using dark mode (even the search box on bottom left doesn't render correctly in dark mode until I hover it). They preinstall some shitty "news" bar right there on the task bar and hide disabling it behind a submenu of a right…

Windows has gone to shit I feel the same way and it makes me sad. I've kept a death-grip on Windows 7 in hopes there would be a Windows 11 one day despite all the naive "last version ever" messaging. Now it's been announced, and I pray it's more than just a paint job. My asks are simple: more stability, better performance, and axed telemetry.

If anything I suspect they will double down on adding internet services to the OS and double down on the app store.

Re: Did Windows 10 slow down with each feature update?

#103

Post by jandrese » Mon, Jun 21, 2021, 7:47 PM UTC

sph wrote: post #71

boba7 wrote: post #5

Anyone finally willing to admit that w10 is unusable on Hard Drives while Linux and W7 work fine on them?

Why do people still expect modern software to run at incredible speeds on hard disk drives? Run old technology with old software. It is ridiculous that consumer hardware is still being sold with crappy 5400 RPM disks in 2021. No, I have no interest in optimising my software for speeds that are 1/10th of my broadband. Unless we're talking archival or huge storage necessities, stop complaining about modern OS or games…

My Linux box runs totally find on spinning drives. I'd like to upgrade but SSDs have gotten very expensive lately. A 2TB SSD is like $300 now.

Re: Did Windows 10 slow down with each feature update?

#104

Post by jokoon » Mon, Jun 21, 2021, 7:51 PM UTC

sph wrote: post #71

boba7 wrote: post #5

Anyone finally willing to admit that w10 is unusable on Hard Drives while Linux and W7 work fine on them?

Why do people still expect modern software to run at incredible speeds on hard disk drives? Run old technology with old software. It is ridiculous that consumer hardware is still being sold with crappy 5400 RPM disks in 2021. No, I have no interest in optimising my software for speeds that are 1/10th of my broadband. Unless we're talking archival or huge storage necessities, stop complaining about modern OS or games…

I don't understand this argument, could you explain why modern software cannot run on old hardware?

It sounds like it's justifying planned obsolescence.

Re: Did Windows 10 slow down with each feature update?

#105

Post by 1_player » Mon, Jun 21, 2021, 7:52 PM UTC

jandrese wrote: post #103

sph wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do people still expect modern software to run at incredible speeds on hard disk drives? Run old technology with old software. It is ridiculous that consumer hardware is still being sold with crappy 5400 RPM disks in 2021. No, I have no interest in optimising my software for speeds that are 1/10th of my broadband. Unless we're talking archival or huge storage necessities, stop complaining about modern OS or games…

My Linux box runs totally find on spinning drives. I'd like to upgrade but SSDs have gotten very expensive lately. A 2TB SSD is like $300 now.

My 486 ran totally fine on 1.44MB floppy disks as well, what is your point?

As I mentioned down thread, you can get 1TB Samsung SSDs right now for $80. Not the best one, still faster than a hard disk. NVMe are a little more expensive than that, and even faster. The price is not really a valid excuse.

Yes, my 2TB NVMe is $300, and does sequential read/writes of 3,000 MB/s, which is close to 100x faster than an HDD. It's not space age technology, solid state storage has been consumer technology for 2 decades already.

Re: Did Windows 10 slow down with each feature update?

#106

Post by Zababa » Mon, Jun 21, 2021, 7:53 PM UTC

sph wrote: post #71

boba7 wrote: post #5

Anyone finally willing to admit that w10 is unusable on Hard Drives while Linux and W7 work fine on them?

Why do people still expect modern software to run at incredible speeds on hard disk drives? Run old technology with old software. It is ridiculous that consumer hardware is still being sold with crappy 5400 RPM disks in 2021. No, I have no interest in optimising my software for speeds that are 1/10th of my broadband. Unless we're talking archival or huge storage necessities, stop complaining about modern OS or games…

What exactly does "modern software" does that justifies needing the hardware to follow at such a pace?

Re: Did Windows 10 slow down with each feature update?

#107

Post by 1_player » Mon, Jun 21, 2021, 7:54 PM UTC

jokoon wrote: post #104

sph wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why do people still expect modern software to run at incredible speeds on hard disk drives? Run old technology with old software. It is ridiculous that consumer hardware is still being sold with crappy 5400 RPM disks in 2021. No, I have no interest in optimising my software for speeds that are 1/10th of my broadband. Unless we're talking archival or huge storage necessities, stop complaining about modern OS or games…

I don't understand this argument, could you explain why modern software cannot run on old hardware? It sounds like it's justifying planned obsolescence.

Can you explain why you expect modern software to run on old hardware first?

Should I be surprised that my turn of the millennium PC can't even run Slack? Yes, in absolute terms it's a bit ridiculous, but we're not talking philosophy here, Moore's law is a thing and software has been getting more complex as hardware got faster. Deal with it.

How is this news?

Re: Did Windows 10 slow down with each feature update?

#108

Post by jokoon » Mon, Jun 21, 2021, 7:59 PM UTC

boba7 wrote: post #5

Anyone finally willing to admit that w10 is unusable on Hard Drives while Linux and W7 work fine on them?

Totally.

Back in 2020, after one update, windows 10 was taking about 5min to boot on a thinkpad, if not more. Had to install a SSD, changed everything.

Pretty curious to hear what kernel developer or filesystem developers have to say about this, because it doesn't really make sense to me.

I can understand why something would stop working, but not to just become slow. In what world does a system change result in worse performance in certain cases?

Maybe deep inside, w10 stopped using any optimization that allowed it to be fast on HDD, considering SSD should be the norm, but I fail to understand if this is choice that implies a difficult compromise, or if it's just laziness and negligence.

Any linux dev could chime in?

Re: Did Windows 10 slow down with each feature update?

#109

Post by nycdotnet » Mon, Jun 21, 2021, 8:00 PM UTC

brudgers wrote: post #68

Some remarks: I used Hyper-V as the hypervisor of choice That is not how most end user installations are configured (aka, not as a virtual machine). 32GB fixed disk for each build. That is much much less than the typical Windows 10 hardware. the fast boot feature has been disabled for the purposes of this measurement. That is not the default and not reflective of most installations.

4 GB RAM seems impossibly tight as well. I'm not sure if 4 core and 4 GB was ever a common or representative setup for PCs; perhaps 2 core and 4 GB in the Vista timeframe...

Re: Did Windows 10 slow down with each feature update?

#110

Post by N00bN00b » Mon, Jun 21, 2021, 8:03 PM UTC

LarryDarrell wrote: post #16

haunter wrote: post #9

On my current gaming PC (i7-7700) I have installed W10 in 2017 and... no problem whatsoever? SSD, 10s boot. idk how do people end up with all the problems. I'm really curious because there must be an underlying reason

I think the Startup Processes really gets abused and people default to blame Windows for it. My time to a usable desktop seemed slow until I removed Teams, Steam, Dropbox and some other update utilities from Startup. Now it's pretty much instant.

I've been using hibernate for years now. I start my computer once per month. I really wouldn't care if it takes 5 minutes.

I'm not sure why that isn't shown by default anymore. But you can still add it to the menu and map it to the power button.