What it's like to be cancelled • Hacker News Board

Re: What it's like to be cancelled

#211

Post by dkjaudyeqooe » Mon, Jun 21, 2021, 7:14 PM UTC

3grdlurker wrote: post #181

We talk about cancel culture like it’s a new horrible thing that’s developed only recently but I don’t see it that way. The internet definitely amplifies the effects, but unkindness begets unkindness, and the consequences or the social cost of one’s unkindness will always catch up to an individual at some point. That said, I draw a line at defamation. When someone is accusing someone online of having committed a crim…

Like so many things, this is something that has existed forever but now it has a new fashionable name and people treat it like it was just invented.

Re: What it's like to be cancelled

#212

Post by njharman » Mon, Jun 21, 2021, 7:15 PM UTC

volkk wrote: post #57

thebooktocome wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I didn't see any libel mentioned in the article. The author seems not to dispute the claims made against him.

have you actually READ the article?

No, of course not. They just read the tweets about the article.

You never read actual sources! That runs risk of accidently seeing something that contradicts your preconceptions of the facts. Then you'll be stuck having to rationalize away the cognitive dissonance.

Re: What it's like to be cancelled

#213

Post by orthecreedence » Mon, Jun 21, 2021, 7:15 PM UTC

brink wrote: post #134

Does anyone think it's any coincidence that the woke mob began cancelling people, and almost immediately it seems like every corporate entity in existence is "woke"? Intimidation sadly works.

Seeing the rainbow flag in every corporate logo is such a vapid and empty gesture. Those entities don't give a fuck about queers, they just want to signal to a bunch of equally vapid people who would otherwise whine and stamp their feet. I'm sick of the whole thing.

"Rainbow capitalism."

Re: What it's like to be cancelled

#214

Post by xyzzy_plugh » Mon, Jun 21, 2021, 7:15 PM UTC

lovecg wrote: post #106

ThaDood wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree, I'm not saying you should have your entire life uprooted because you said something stupid on Twitter when you were like 13. The situation in this case is a little different. Again, don't be a dick or try to avoid it when possible and I don't think you will have to worry about being canceled.

What do you think about cases like this one? https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/new-brunswick/mount-allison-s... An immigrant _tenured_ professor in Canada got suspended for saying that Canada is not racist on her blog. Was she being a dick? Does she deserve the “consequences”? At what point do we stop saying “oh these are isolated incidents and not a trend”?

As a Canadian, yeah that's a pretty awful thing to say. Canada is definitely racist -- and I'd go so far as to say that it's safe to assume that everywhere and everyone is racist to some extent.

Supporting the idea that you (individual, organization, country, whatever) are not racist makes it convenient to ignore efforts to combat racism ("why should we combat racism when there isn't any") which should be universally supported.

So yeah she was being a dick. As a representative of Mount Allison, they decided her behaviour was problematic, which they are in the right to do. Just because you're a powerful person with a fancy title doesn't make you immune from consequences of shitty behaviour.

Re: What it's like to be cancelled

#215

Post by noahbradley » Mon, Jun 21, 2021, 7:15 PM UTC

defaultname wrote: post #195

Animats wrote: post #143

What he's supposed to have done: “I was terrible to women. I preyed on them. I ceaselessly hit on them. I pressured them into sex. I got too drunk and did all manner of dumb things.” None of which is illegal. It's not even a matter for civil litigation. He was not accused of doing this as a boss in an organization. Or in a workplace context. There were apparently no criminal charges. No EEOC complaints filed.[1] No a…

The original complaint claimed that he was a groper. That's sexual harassment. It's illegal. It's incredibly toxic and creepy , and people who do it are out of touch cretins who make everything worse. Citing that no one officially lodged a criminal complaint isn't a counterpoint. Most sexual assault isn't pursued. Serial creeps are plying their trade right now. But yeah, if he's associated with a brand and he's going…

I never groped anyone.

Re: What it's like to be cancelled

#216

Post by saul_goodman » Mon, Jun 21, 2021, 7:16 PM UTC

prepend wrote: post #11

I think the biggest problem with Twitter is that we can’t determine a denominator. Twitter knows, but we don’t know. 100 people tweeting about how this guy is bad might be indicative of a general consensus or might just be 100 people out of a billion Twitter users. People then interpret it as general consensus and pile on. We know the numerator but since we don’t know the denominator of people who didn’t comment, or…

[flagged]

Re: What it's like to be cancelled

#217

Post by surround » Mon, Jun 21, 2021, 7:16 PM UTC

overgard wrote: post #99

I've fortunately never been cancelled (I don't think I even have enough of a footprint or visibility for that to happen). From everything I've observed, the absolute worst thing you can do is apologize to the people attempting to cancel you. It's just pouring gasoline on the fire. These people will never say "oh, you learned from your mistakes, I guess I'll back off" . Most of them don't really care about the truth,…

Every single internet apology I've seen has been met with "this is such a bad apology / isn't a real apology." I'd love to see an example of an internet apology where people don't criticize the apology itself (if one exists).

Re: What it's like to be cancelled

#218

Post by d0mine » Mon, Jun 21, 2021, 7:17 PM UTC

laurent123456 wrote: post #100

It seems it's better to stay away entirely from certain sensitive topics. No matter your intentions, no matter what you actually think, it just takes a bit of misunderstanding or bad faith and the whole thing explode.

“When the Nazis arrested the Communists, I said nothing; after all, I was not a Communist. When they locked up the Social Democrats, I said nothing; after all, I was not a Social Democrat. When they arrested the trade unionists, I said nothing; after all, I was not a trade unionist. When they arrested me, there was no longer anyone who could protest.” https://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Martin_Niemöller

Re: What it's like to be cancelled

#219

Post by moate » Mon, Jun 21, 2021, 7:17 PM UTC

vagrantJin wrote: post #112

qbasic_forever wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Alternatively, don't be a sexual predator that assumes it will never lead to any consequences later in life.

Whats the difference between having sex and being a sexual predator? Do you just make things up as you go? The frightening thing about "cancel culture" isnt that its new or eye-opening. Its has always existed, sandboxed, in places called school playgrounds . The world have adults has this annoying thing called due process. Filing cases, going to court, giving evidence etc etc. Now that the playground rules are statin…

I mean, "angry mobs" have always existed as you said yourself. They didn't seep into "adult spaces", they've always been there. We don't need to blame Twitter, the Internet as a whole, anonymous communication platforms or anything else for human nature.

The fight against cancel culture is a fight against people doing things. It's literally that. "Cancelling" is just a framing device for a myriad of behaviors and reasoning behind those behaviors. If this post gets downvotes, "cancel culture". If OP's post gets a bunch of negative comments, "cancel culture".

TL;dr- There's never been an egalitarian, logic-only meritocracy, in human history, and people getting upset that there isn't one is as reasonable a choice as other people deciding to "cancel" someone.

Re: What it's like to be cancelled

#220

Post by jmull » Mon, Jun 21, 2021, 7:17 PM UTC

throwaway34017 wrote: post #56

I recently gave a test lecture about a topic in statistics, where I showed a meme that a statistics professor I follow shared on her Twitter feed [1]. I thought it would be safe to include as it didn't get any negative reactions on Twitter and was already being used by a professor in her university class in the US. After the talk I immediately got called out by the women's representative on the hiring commission, who…

It wouldn’t bother me personally, but it’a a little crude and objectifying. Whether it’s funny or offensive depends on the audience. I think you got a clear signal that at least someone found it offensive, which means others probably did as well, so I’d recalibrate my behavior based on that feedback.

Also, keep in mind that context is important. That meme may come off very differently coming from a popular, well-established female professor who is passing along a student creation after class than dropped into a formal lecture, especially if they don’t know you well yet.