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Ivermectin for Prevention and Treatment of Covid-19 Infection

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121–130 of 644 posts

Re: Ivermectin for Prevention and Treatment of Covid-19 Infection

#121
post #100
post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can't get EUA for the vaccines if there's a working treatment. The doctor who promoted Hydroxychloroquine and zinc treatment, Dr. Zelenko, is still banned from Twitter for spreading COVID disinformation. There's both actual conspiracies in this world, and well poisoning to damage the conversations. When you look at the amount of money these companies stand to make from producing billions of vaccinations, you shou…

Pfizer, a company that has contributed probably trillions of dollars to global GDP over the past 6 months, is massively underperforming the stock market when you compare pre-pandemic to now [1]. The stock price in theory should price in all the future cash flows from the vaccine. What is your basis that the pharma companies are making tons of money on these vaccines? It isn't like the vaccines are pure profit. The ph…

"everybody in the world is benefiting"

Did the patent issues get resolved? Last I heard, the drug companies didn't want to share because of reasons.

Re: Ivermectin for Prevention and Treatment of Covid-19 Infection

#122

What is this thing with alt-right figures like Bret Weinstein (and others) promoting particular medicines / self-medication through theirs shows? It is weird and cult like - why not just stick to politics?

Why makes you think Bret Weinstein is alt right?

I have watched his shows. Intellectual alt right is a quite suitable label for this guy.

Re: Ivermectin for Prevention and Treatment of Covid-19 Infection

#123
post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can't get EUA for the vaccines if there's a working treatment. The doctor who promoted Hydroxychloroquine and zinc treatment, Dr. Zelenko, is still banned from Twitter for spreading COVID disinformation. There's both actual conspiracies in this world, and well poisoning to damage the conversations. When you look at the amount of money these companies stand to make from producing billions of vaccinations, you shou…

Dr. Zelenko held studies that 'showed' that HCQ had 100% cure rate by excluding people that moved to an ICU from the treatment group. The studies turned out to be complete bunk. He's a fraud.

https://sebastianrushworth.com/2021/03/04/hydroxychloroquine...

Two observational studies, both carried out in New York (Carlucci et al. and Derwan et al.), appear to show promising results in patients treated with a combination of hydroxychloroquine, zinc, and azithromycin. The first, involving 932 paitents, showed a 55% reduction in relative risk of death among those getting zinc in addition to hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin, as compared with those just getting hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin. The second, involving 518 patients, showed an 80% reduction in relative risk of death among those getting the full triple therapy, when compared with a reference sample that didn’t get any of the drugs.

That seems impressive. However, these are low quality observational studies that are seriously limited by the methodology used. The scope for confounding effects is huge. Therefore, these studies should be considered exploratory and hypothesis generating. They certainly should not be considered evidence of any cause and effect relationship.

Re: Ivermectin for Prevention and Treatment of Covid-19 Infection

#124
post #120

Also, and feel free to downvote... > multiple authoritative sources Gross! Authority is the problem. We need to use our own minds. The very idea that an ad tech co is backing an amorphous group of authoritative governmental bodies is repugnant. > And here is Merck, that sells Ivermectin Ivermectin has been out of patent for years--so it is not particularly profitable anyway. The initial claim insinuates that Merck we…

It's impossible to be an expert in every field, particularly those as complicated as medicine. Furthermore, you don't have to rely on authority, I linked to an RCT showing it was ineffective. "Not particularly profitable", which is speculative, is still profitable. I highly doubt any one at Merck is actively working against selling a drug they already manufacture at a profit, but feel free to provide evidence otherwi…

Can you explain how the RCT is more useful than the meta-analysis that was posted as the OP?

Re: Ivermectin for Prevention and Treatment of Covid-19 Infection

#125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hydroperoxyl (the common name for hydrogen dioxide) should just break down into water and oxygen gas as soon as it encounters H+ ions (e.g. when it touches liquid water), no? Is there some particular reason you think the dangers are being repressed? If your answer is something to do with "free radicals" my understanding is that most of those come from metabolic processes rather than things you eat.

Thanks for correcting me, meant to say dihydrogen monoxide, aka water ;) My point being that you can over-dose on almost any compound at high enough doses. So instead of driving the conversation underground and letting patients self-medicate, we should empower doctors with proper information rather than painting Ivermectin as a conspiracy theory drug

Ah, yeah. Some actual RCTs with a decent sample size would be nice though, so as to have proper information to empower doctors and patients with.

Re: Ivermectin for Prevention and Treatment of Covid-19 Infection

#126
I Googled Ivermectin meta-analysis. But instead of finding the article we're discussing now, I found a different meta-analysis.

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.05.21.21257595v...

It concluded Ivermectin "did not reduce all-cause mortality, length of stay or viral clearance in RCTs in COVID-19 patients with mostly mild disease. IVM did not have effect on AEs or SAEs. IVM is not a viable option to treat COVID-19 patients."

But wait... Before you upvote or downvote me, I want to say this proves something entirely different than what we may think. It proves that there's lots of studies -- some say one thing, some say another. I can produce a study which seems to convincingly prove one side of an issue -- and somebody else can produce a different study which seems to show the opposite.

Re: Ivermectin for Prevention and Treatment of Covid-19 Infection

#127
post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From what I understand, it's the anti-inflammatory piece of Ivermectin that can help with covid because, apparently, the respiratory issue with covid is not caused by covid directly but rather an overexcited autoimmune response. I'm not a doctor but that's what some doctors on YouTube have said ;)

Antiinflammatories are generally useful against all kinds of things. Inflammation is a common side effect of infection. I find that answer unsatisfactory. If "it's an anti-inflammatory!" is The Answer, there are lots of antiinflammatories out there.

ivermectin effects chloride channels in neurons of parasites.

in mammals ivermectin effects nuclear transport protiens responsible for mediating signal peptide transport to the nucleus.

the in vivo concentration corresponding to EC50 was reported in the range of 2. to 5. micromolar this is a very problematic dose, for humans; this drug targets host, and pathogen, albeit by different mechanisms.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ivermectin

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COVID-19_misinformation#Iverme...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COVID-19_drug_repurposing_rese...

Re: Ivermectin for Prevention and Treatment of Covid-19 Infection

#128
post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is from the FDA website. "Under section 564 of the Federal Food, Drug, and Cosmetic Act (FD&C Act), when the Secretary of HHS declares that an emergency use authorization is appropriate, FDA may authorize unapproved medical products or unapproved uses of approved medical products to be used in an emergency to diagnose, treat, or prevent serious or life-threatening diseases or conditions caused by CBRN threat age…

Can you point to anything that says the FDA would consider HCQ or any of these other drugs as alternatives to vaccines? They are not the same, and though they could both treat COVID, my reading is not that this would limit vaccine emergency authorization if there was a non vaccine treatment. This is especially true considering there are multiple vaccines approved under emergency use which would be direct competitors.…

I believe it means vaccines should go typical testing and vetting process, not the emergency shortened, is what the op wanted to tell.

Re: Ivermectin for Prevention and Treatment of Covid-19 Infection

#129
N=1. Me and my 2 year old had covid. My wife started ivermectin and never got sick. Shared bed and sick 2 year old wants mommy.

Ivermectin didn't work for me (diarrhea) but my fever went from 102.7 down to 99 12 hours after HQC after 6 days of a slow downward spiral (fever kept going up and up every day). So for me, my take is the drugs absolutely worked.

Re: Ivermectin for Prevention and Treatment of Covid-19 Infection

#130
post #76

It's banned on YouTube because of multiple authoritative sources indicating it's not a safe and effective treatment for COVID-19. Here is the FDA's stance: https://www.fda.gov/consumers/consumer-updates/why-you-shoul... Here is the European equivalent of the AMA advising against it's use: https://www.ema.europa.eu/en/news/ema-advises-against-use-iv... Here is an RCT in JAMA finding it ineffective: https://jamanetwork…

WHO statement: https://www.who.int/news-room/feature-stories/detail/who-adv...
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