Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

The Hair Dryer Incident (2014)

quotulatiousness.ca

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

121–130 of 275 posts

Re: The Hair Dryer Incident (2014)

#121

Post by lazide »

thaumasiotes wrote: post #111
kdmccormick wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No. It's a misconception that mental disorders are meant to categorize folks by sets of character/personality traits, whether or not they negatively impact someone. No, you do not have "a bit of OCD" if disorganization simply stresses you out. On the contrary, mental disorders are labels expressely intended to inform and enable treatment of distress. Disorder and treatment are inextricably linked. This is all accordi…

You're elaborating on how the categories are intended to be meaningless, but you're not doing much to claim that they are in fact not meaningless. If someone has low occupational functioning, you could call that a disorder. But why would you call it "ADHD"? Why would you call it ADHD for some people and OCD for other people? Suppose you have two lists of symptoms: Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder - Patient ha…

That is definitely not how it is defined through - it seems to be a straw man?

The criteria is essentially ‘you meet these criteria AND it causes clear problems with your ability to live your life’.

It doesn’t mean you have a bad job and X, therefore you have ADHD. Rather, you show ADHD traits and they get in the way (and cause you distress) in doing a job you otherwise would be entirely capable of doing. Or consistently fail (and have distress) on social environments you’d otherwise be perfectly fine in, etc.

If you don’t have a criteria like that, there is no useful criteria at all, since practically all medicine is oriented towards fixing things that aren’t working correctly/causing problems.

It’s the same type of criteria used for evaluating everything from heart disease to stroke to a broken bone. Or in other words ‘if it ain’t broken, then it isn’t broken.’

Re: The Hair Dryer Incident (2014)

#122

Post by thequux »

pmichaud wrote: post #78
Ensorceled wrote: post #36

I remember a panel on a news program years ago where the one guest was a psychologist who was treating "untreatable" drug addicts by getting them "hooked" on running or weightlifting or martial arts. They would stop drugs but would instead be doing martial arts for hours a day or running 20 miles every morning. Then he would start treating the addiction personality and causes, but in many cases the patients would jus…

Do you remember the name of the psychologist or any info I might use to look him up?

Scott Alexander. He used to post on slatestarcodex.com, but has since moved to astralcodexten.substack.com .

Re: The Hair Dryer Incident (2014)

#124

Post by thaumasiotes »

lazide wrote: post #121
thaumasiotes wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're elaborating on how the categories are intended to be meaningless, but you're not doing much to claim that they are in fact not meaningless. If someone has low occupational functioning, you could call that a disorder. But why would you call it "ADHD"? Why would you call it ADHD for some people and OCD for other people? Suppose you have two lists of symptoms: Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder - Patient ha…

That is definitely not how it is defined through - it seems to be a straw man? The criteria is essentially ‘you meet these criteria AND it causes clear problems with your ability to live your life’. It doesn’t mean you have a bad job and X, therefore you have ADHD. Rather, you show ADHD traits and they get in the way (and cause you distress) in doing a job you otherwise would be entirely capable of doing. Or consiste…

That is absolutely not how strokes and broken bones are diagnosed. If one of your bones breaks, you have a broken bone. Whether it hurts, or stops you from doing things you'd like to do, is an unrelated question.

Re: The Hair Dryer Incident (2014)

#125

Post by TimTheTinker »

neutronicus wrote: post #94
gwbas1c wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> could only be diagnosed with ADHD if your life was worse than "the norm" Because ADHD is a real situation for some people, and for others it's a way to legally take class-B stimulants. Yes, people really do try their friends' ADHD medication, enjoy it, and then shop around doctors to find someone who will prescribe it. It's called "drug seeking," and doctors do flag patients who do it. This, BTW, is what happens wi…

I'm ADHD-diagnosed, and god damn do I wish I could just go to the store and get Adderall when I feel like I need it The fact that I have to call someone and get a prescription every month just makes it so that I go untreated for months at a time (kind of a cruel irony that ADHD treatment is gated behind the wherewithal to make a monthly phone call). And honestly I think modern life is probably such that most people c…

Have you tried a nicotine patch?

Taken for a short period each morning at a low dose (cut an 8mg patch into sections) it offers similar stimulant effects, but with fewer side-effects. Nicotine patches are reportedly less agitating, less addictive, less expensive, and more available than Adderall. It also measurably improves cognitive ability according to some studies I've read online.

I'm almost 40 years old, and I have ADHD-inattentive. For two weeks I've been using sections of nicotine patches - about 1/4 of an 8mg patch for an hour each morning, and I have never found it more easy to be focused and productive.

Just be careful to not use too much, especially if you've never been a recreational nicotine user. I've had several nights when it's been difficult to sleep -- which has been a signal that I need to decrease the morning dose.

(I'm not a doctor, this is not medical advice)

Re: The Hair Dryer Incident (2014)

#126

Post by underwater »

Johnny555 wrote: post #117
aspyct wrote: post #83

I personally have problems with doors, and stuff that should be locked. I can never be sure I locked properly. Totally did backtrack unreasonable distances just to check if I had closed the door. It's all fine when it's my door. Worst case scenario, I get robbed. However it's more of a problem when it's someone else's door. Worst case scenario, they get robbed, and that's a different story. Or pets get out... Obvious…

I used to work with someone who had that same problem with door locks, he'd sometimes leave work to make sure he locked his door. This was well before the days of ubiquitous web based home security cameras, but he rigged up a video camera and a video capture card on his PC to take a picture of the door (and door lock) and post it on a web page every minute. So he could easily check to verify that the door was closed…

I don't see why he wouldn't trust it. The OCD seems to be an anxiety triggered by the uncertainty of his memory, rather than paranoia.

Re: The Hair Dryer Incident (2014)

#127

Post by aspyct »

malka wrote: post #120
aspyct wrote: post #83

I personally have problems with doors, and stuff that should be locked. I can never be sure I locked properly. Totally did backtrack unreasonable distances just to check if I had closed the door. It's all fine when it's my door. Worst case scenario, I get robbed. However it's more of a problem when it's someone else's door. Worst case scenario, they get robbed, and that's a different story. Or pets get out... Obvious…

I am totally gonna use your solution. Thanks. This has been a huge problem for me as well.

Good luck :)

Re: The Hair Dryer Incident (2014)

#128

Post by cowboysauce »

caethan wrote: post #105
cowboysauce wrote: post #70

I've read most of Scott's blog posts and he rarely mentions OCD and when he does it tends to be "this is what I think people with OCD experience" and not "this is what my patients have told me" which leads me to believe that he is not an expert in OCD. I have OCD and it's ruined my life in ways that are hard to articulate. Which is why I can point out two good reasons why what's being described might not be a good id…

Scott has OCD. Search for "obsessive compulsive disorder" here: https://slatestarcodex.com/2014/04/11/going-loopy/

That's strange. My impression came from his article about the Chamber of Guf where he talks about pure OCD, but it sounds like he's only read about it and never actually met someone with it.

I wonder if the disconnect is in taking the story in an idealistic way vs a practical way. Like sure, if you had someone for whom that works utterly when nothing else works then yeah, do that. But I don't think that's a realistic scenario.

Re: The Hair Dryer Incident (2014)

#129

Post by kdmccormick »

thaumasiotes wrote: post #124
lazide wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is definitely not how it is defined through - it seems to be a straw man? The criteria is essentially ‘you meet these criteria AND it causes clear problems with your ability to live your life’. It doesn’t mean you have a bad job and X, therefore you have ADHD. Rather, you show ADHD traits and they get in the way (and cause you distress) in doing a job you otherwise would be entirely capable of doing. Or consiste…

That is absolutely not how strokes and broken bones are diagnosed. If one of your bones breaks, you have a broken bone. Whether it hurts, or stops you from doing things you'd like to do, is an unrelated question.

I think you're missing the point. Let me be concrete.

I'm diagnosed with bipolar disorder. Sometimes I feel axnious and euphoric, other times depressed and lethargic, both at extremes noticably deviant from the average person. This has caused all sorts of turbulence and distress in my personal and academic life. Being diagnosed allowed me access to therapy and prescriptions.

There exist plenty of people who oscillate between distinctively high and low moods, but have never found themselves in serious distress because of it. Thus, they have not been diagnosed with bipolar disorder. Whether or not they "are bipolar" is a subjective question that mainstream psychiatry doesn't seem to have an opinion on.

Re: The Hair Dryer Incident (2014)

#130

Post by sp332 »

michaelkeenan wrote: post #103
fpgaminer wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Recently I was reading a book on ADHD and the author was quite adamant that you could only be diagnosed with ADHD if your life was worse than "the norm". In this view, if you have symptoms of ADHD but can, for instance, hold down a good job then by definition you don't have ADHD. I deleted the book from my Audible account. IANAP, but that sounds correct to me. I recall the DSM requiring negative impact on one's lif…

The same psychiatrist from the hair dryer incident in the link has written about this. He's skeptical about ADHD being a discrete condition, and generally thinks that if ADHD drugs will help you focus, taking them is reasonable whether you're diagnosed with ADHD or not: > Psychiatric guidelines are very clear on this point: only give Adderall to people who “genuinely” “have” “ADHD”. > But “ability to concentrate” is…

Sure, and that wouldn't change who gets a diagnosis.
Post reply on HN