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Fewer young men are in the labor force, more are living at home

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Re: Fewer young men are in the labor force, more are living at home

#321

Is anybody advocating for them or encouraging them in any way? I can’t think of a single group which aims to highlight men, uplift men, and encourage masculine behavior. These guys grew up in a school system of almost entirely women teachers, and popular media tells them that if they are successful in any way, it is due to oppression. It’s no wonder why they’re not succeeding. We spent the last 15 years telling them…

Oh please. There's nothing wrong with the way female teachers teach.

Re: Fewer young men are in the labor force, more are living at home

#322

I have a very multicultural background, but the dominant cultural view, at least when it comes to money, is Chinese. For us, living at home is not failure. Moving out without planning to start a family if you live in the same city as your parents is considered wasting money. You instead use it as an opportunity to save a pile of money and invest. How much of this is just cultural change? It isn't failure to launch. I…

It's also much harder to buy your own place these days.

Re: Fewer young men are in the labor force, more are living at home

#323

Video game addiction is a real problem. I spent my freshman year of college rooming with man-children who played video games non-stop. They didn't explore the city, they didn't meet new people, they just played video games in the dark, screaming into their headsets and eating their takeout at their desk. People can certainly have a healthy, fruitful relationship to video games but since then I haven't felt the need t…

What made them "man-children"?

Re: Fewer young men are in the labor force, more are living at home

#324

Video game addiction is a real problem. I spent my freshman year of college rooming with man-children who played video games non-stop. They didn't explore the city, they didn't meet new people, they just played video games in the dark, screaming into their headsets and eating their takeout at their desk. People can certainly have a healthy, fruitful relationship to video games but since then I haven't felt the need t…

Not a psychologist, but I would guess that playing games at all times is more a symptom than a cause. A symptom of depression? A coping mechanism for chronic anxiety? A happy well adjusted person does not try so hard to escape reality or responsibilities. Demeaning them by calling them man-children is not going to help them in the slightest.

As someone who has chronic anxiety and depression, for me it goes both ways. I do it as a coping mechanism, but doing it too much also worsens it. When I do things like go outside or make an effort to see people it goes down.

Completely agree calling someone a man-child does not help. We would condemn that kind of language said about woman.

Re: Fewer young men are in the labor force, more are living at home

#325
post #255

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's the parents fault for coddling them. If they kicked them out at 18, the nephews would definitely need to work and may realize the importance of having a better job/career.

I deal with a lot of 18-19 year olds as my primary job is teaching first year engineering students. I will tell you it is a LOT more complicated than this. This type of single point simplification and pronouncement about 'coddling' is decidedly unhelpful. For starters, if you grow up in two working parent household, both parents can easily come home completely exhausted and unable to provide the extended engagement n…

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Re: Fewer young men are in the labor force, more are living at home

#326

I'm in the labor force, but live at home. I can absolutely afford to purchase a home. Why don't I? Because I'm not spending $250,000+ on 1400sq ft. These types of articles make it seem like some huge mystery as to why society is the way it is today. It's no mystery. Houses cost to much and employers don't pay enough.

Dang, only $250k for 1400 sqft? That would easily be $1.25M+ here.

The pay is probably higher where you are, and in smaller markets (OP) people that are from your market are moving in driving up prices so that natives can't afford anything. That is my current situation as well, in the Nashville market. Homes that were only $300K a few years ago have shot up to $600-700K in just 3 years. A 2 bedroom condo 10 years ago that was $200K is now closer to a million.

Re: Fewer young men are in the labor force, more are living at home

#327
post #174
post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This has a lot of parallels to "opt-out" syndrome in Japan. Given the concurrent rise of VanLife and FIRE cultural phenomena it's worth considering why many individuals in developed economies ideal life is to not work. I'd hypothesize that the rising costs both economic, and mental associated with what many consider a basic standard of living independently probably has alot to do with it. Why work when 60 hours per w…

What are the FIRE cultural phenomena?

Financial Independence, Retire Early

https://www.investopedia.com/terms/f/financial-independence-...

Re: Fewer young men are in the labor force, more are living at home

#328

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Depression is often characterised by a struggle in finding the motivation / desire to do something you love: if they love video games and can play them 12 hours a day, it's very possible they simply... don't care about the outside world. A job, family, exploring the world, these are all things some people just don't like. They don't have to have mental illness in order to spend their lives doing one thing!

> They don't have to have mental illness in order to spend their lives doing one thing! I'd argue that doing one thing for the rest of your life is a classic definition of mental illness.

Tell that to the vast majority of humans throughout history who not only did 1 thing their whole life, but did the same thing their parents did before them. In some cultures to this day, trying to do anything other than what your family has already established as the family business is viewed as disrespectful and an insult to your lineage.

Re: Fewer young men are in the labor force, more are living at home

#329
post #262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did they grow up with their biological father?

Not after they were around 6 and 8. Their mom remarried when they were in their teens. So yeah, probably that's part of the problem. But their biological father was also quite lazy and never had a job for very long (part of the reason she left him, that and he did a good bit of gaslighting) so it's not like he was a great example for them to follow (In fact, last I heard he was living with his parents and he's well i…

Thanks for sharing. I sympathize with your cousins, as I believe they are the product of their upbringing. Surely they didn't choose this life either.

Re: Fewer young men are in the labor force, more are living at home

#330
post #269

What are the things that motivates them, and what do they themselves want to do in life? I ask this because much of the undertone in the article and in this thread is about the failure of meeting the gender role expectations that are put on young men. Do they have a job and a car? Have they studied hard so they can get a good job in order to support a wife and kid? Culture in the last several decades have hammered do…

> What are the things that motivates them, and what do they themselves want to do in life? I suspect quite a few people are looking at the odds of achieving various goals, and simply changing the goals. Such as owning a home in desirable areas, or having kids if you cannot afford a food school district or a job that allows you to be home for dinner. Or if you have experienced income instability, and you do not feel c…

> Or if you have experienced income instability, and you do not feel comfortable bringing children into the world.

Yet poorer developing nations have higher birth rates than developed nations. Is it because they have lower expectations for what their children need to live a "good" life, that they just have more hope that things will work out somehow, or that they somehow don't care about these concerns?

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