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Linus Torvalds on mRNA Vaccines

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Re: Linus Torvalds on mRNA Vaccines

#551

Post by macksd »

thatfrenchguy wrote: post #53
macksd wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I just happen to know a lot of anesthesiologists and they went to all of med school - I didn't. They were easy to ask and know more than me. The first nurse, again, more medical education than me to begin with, was very interested in the science beyond his work and was obviously briefed on the situation at work as it changed. I just figured it might have been more common knowledge than it turned out to be. My point i…

It's a little bit like asking a random software engineer on the street on how GPU drivers work internally: they're unlikely to have an actual informed opinion.

Except here's the thing: I do know how GPU drivers work internally so assuming I don't when someone wants to know isn't helpful, and I did end up getting referred to a helpful answer by one of the medical friends who had a connection and could make an introduction. I can't believe this is being dismissed as a moronic approach when it actually worked and I just asked in casual conversation with friends - all of whom were actually intrigued by the question as well and wanted to know the answer when I eventually learnt it.

If most of the whole world came to a screeching halt for the better part of a year and the solution turned out to be GPU drivers, I as a software engineer would become intensely interested in understanding them and would not at all be surprised if my less technical friends asked me for some pointers.

In the end, my point was that people who aren't even software engineers were telling me to stop trying to understand GPU drivers because GPU drivers are a solved problem and I should just trust NVIDIA.

Re: Linus Torvalds on mRNA Vaccines

#552

Post by kaba0 »

nsonha wrote: post #547
kaba0 wrote: post #480

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What Linus writes is accurate, you may have misunderstood him. A dose of mRNA is transported to a few cells, and these cells temporarily gets the command to create spike proteins. These proteins will be transported outside your body and be recognized by the immune system. There is no need to constantly create them as the immune system can learn from this alone. And it is temporary because mRNA is constantly degrading…

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oMXGGmBfkf8&t=125s It says "low risk" of being integrated into the genome. Sounds like there is still a risk.

It's not low, it's basically non-existent. It's perhaps just a needlessly defensive way of saying so in the video, since there are biologically a way for mRNA to turn into DNA. But it has an effect only on an evolutionary timescale.

But my second paragraph here is about what would this cause theoretically: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27468123

Re: Linus Torvalds on mRNA Vaccines

#553

Post by docmars »

gopiandcode wrote: post #545
docmars wrote: post #520

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is this a conspiracy theory? Why jump to that conclusion about this person's perfectly reasonable statement and hypothesis? Stories of children either passing out or dying because they were required to wear masks during track outdoors. Or hell, walking my normal pace (quite fast), I breathe pretty heavily and the amount of oxygen my body takes in with a mask is markedly reduced versus when I'm not wearing one. It…

> Stories about children either passing out or dying because they were required to wear masks. Do you have any citations for these events, because they seem to be absurd misinformation. The country I'm in (Singapore) has legally required masks in public since last year (as have many other countries) so everyone is wearing masks, and so far, I have not heard of a single case of people suffering due to wearing masks. I…

(1) Two Chinese Boys Die Wearing Face Masks During Gym Class https://www.nydailynews.com/coronavirus/ny-coronavirus-two-c...

(2) After Multiple Deaths, Officials Call for No Masks in Gym Class https://www.sixthtone.com/news/1005609/after-multiple-deaths...

(3) Oregon high school junior breaks 800-meter school record and falls face-first at finish line as mask restricts breathing https://twitter.com/covid_clarity/status/1387212971399540737

(4) New Jersey driver crashes car after passing out from wearing N95 mask https://nypost.com/2020/04/24/driver-crashes-car-after-passi...

(5) Medical Doctor Warns that “Bacterial Pneumonias Are on the Rise” from Mask Wearing https://www.globalresearch.ca/medical-doctor-warns-bacterial...

Enjoy! :)

Re: Linus Torvalds on mRNA Vaccines

#554

Post by Siira »

tekknik wrote: post #441
gremlinsinc wrote: post #386

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I had someone tell me "science" is made to "replace" religion as another control mechanism... it's the "new religion". I was at a loss of words...

Just like I’m at a loss for words as to why you think religion is a source of control. Unless you mean discipline. Why do people still have to attack religion?

Because not everyone is an effective atheist like in your bubble.

Re: Linus Torvalds on mRNA Vaccines

#555

Post by tim333 »

hayanno wrote: post #530
berkes wrote: post #478

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you have any examples of such 'reasonable views' that are ignored? Because I don't. I do see a lot of reasonable objections making headlines or having a large impact. E.g. side effects halting entire campaigns for weeks, or large articles highlighting the dowsides of various vaccines, debates on particle sizes and fluid dynamics on national TV and so on.

"If you and your family are more protected these days, it's because of all those other people who made the right choice" I do not understand that from my point of view, what I heard what that vaccine didn't stop you from being contagious to other people. I'm looking for an educated answer, I'm not anti-vaxx, far from it, I'm just curious about it.

Doesn't stop but reduces a lot. You are about 10x less likely to catch covid with a vaccine and about 2x less likely to spread it if you do.

Also if you compare a population of 100 million people who mostly have that 20x protection with one that doesn't and infect one person the the end result is one or two infections in the first case and about 100 million in the second.

Re: Linus Torvalds on mRNA Vaccines

#556

Post by macksd »

ceejayoz wrote: post #303
lethologica wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s a starting point though. How often do you get to your answers immediately without having to go through some dead ends and wrong turns? That’s how learning works.

> It’s a starting point though. The point is that the nurse and the car mechanic are at about the same starting point on the subject. Being willing to learn is great, but they have minimal extant knowledge from their profession .

Everyone seems to be missing the part of the story where I actually got connections and introductions to others in the medical field and got an answer, and the part where an anesthesiologist actually gave me what turned out to be a pretty good guess at the answer because they DO understand biology in general better than me and hey do have to learn a lot about the immune system even if they specialty isn't vaccines.

My point was that the less educated someone is in the medical field in general, the less willing they seem to be to entertain a genuine question, and this is the opposite of being "pro-science". It's only a step above being an anti-vaxxer because they choose better experts to listen to.

Re: Linus Torvalds on mRNA Vaccines

#557

Post by marcodiego »

trutannus wrote: post #133
pciexpgpu wrote: post #18

This is good. Now states are combating such hesitancy by drawing lottery for vaccinated folks. Like, having this magic, absolutely mind boggling potion that prevents serious illness and death *isn't* already the lottery win of our lifetime?? People in India and elsewhere are dying because of lack of vaccines and here we have educated, first world countries struggle to get their citizens vaccinated. Unfortunately sham…

> Like, having this magic, absolutely mind boggling potion that prevents serious illness and death isn't already the lottery win of our lifetime A lot of it boils down to people not trusting what they're seeing. Frankly, governments have done the world a disservice by speaking before they really had all the information at the start of the pandemic. In Canada at least an insane amount of what was said turned out to be…

> I think if we approach the problem with that in mind we might win more people over than telling them "listen to experts", since for the past year and a half experts have been wrong almost as often as they have been right.

I was educated to fear more those who are never wrong.

Re: Linus Torvalds on mRNA Vaccines

#558

Post by bmn__ »

Aachen wrote: post #490
tptacek wrote: post #264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, I think the alternative here is asking vaccinologists.

I have some more questions (serious), can I have the number of one of these people? Point being, it's not that straightforward unless there's someone you already know that is willing to share their contact information and they actually have the time to talk to you. I totally see the point about going for second-best first until you know you have a question worth their time and not something that's obvious. (Although…

> I have some more questions (serious)

Contact the department of health education of the ministry of health. You already paid for it with your taxes, might as well make use of it.

Re: Linus Torvalds on mRNA Vaccines

#559

Post by bmn__ »

panny wrote: post #476
chipotle_coyote wrote: post #467

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well. "medalerts.org" is the "National Vaccine Information Center", a notorious source of vaccine misinformation, pushing the thoroughly discredited theory that vaccines cause autism, and lately -- surprise -- being widely criticized as one of the worst pushers of Covid-19 misinformation. A substantial amount of their funding comes from Joseph Mercola, which, well, yikes. (Why I say "yikes" is left as an exercise for…

>a notorious source of vaccine misinformation Are you suggesting their information isn't the same as the CDC? Have any proof of it? >But VAERS (the "Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System") is from the CDC, right? Great! Except that it's an open database -- anyone can submit a report and there is no verification. Again, do you have any proof that there is a conspiracy to fill the VAERS database with fake data about c…

Nothing is safe. It's always a trade-off. I guess people are downvoting you because they think you misjudge the trade-off.

Re: Linus Torvalds on mRNA Vaccines

#560

Post by bmn__ »

tekknik wrote: post #521
bmn__ wrote: post #512

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why do people still have to attack religion? Because religions are still dangerous animals, if you would indulge this metaphor. Just because we managed to declaw and tame one (values of Enlightenment supplanting values of Christianity), it does not mean that we can treat all of them imprudently. I suggest that you are arguing from the point-of-view that "my $ANIMAL is well-behaved and has not and would not hurt any…

> Because religions are still dangerous animals With all but one preaching peace, and not hate, please explain.

There is a vast gulf between what is preached and what adherents do or don't do. Knowing human nature, I think all religions have suffered abuse in the form of having peace on paper, but inciting hate through opportunists.
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