Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Software is eating the car

spectrum.ieee.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

511–520 of 549 posts

Re: Software is eating the car

#511

Post by andrewmcwatters »

fomine3 wrote: post #473
andrewmcwatters wrote: post #32

Maybe not a "dumb" car, but yes, I would like to see more good analog options if the digital alternative is getting screens in cars that look utterly embarrassing compared to yesteryear's netbook-sized screen fad. If you're going to put tech in my car, you better go all the way. I'm talking a huge screen, fast multicore processor or redundant systems, touchscreen to UI update response times under 5ms. None of this no…

I believe 5ms E2E is impossible. https://danluu.com/input-lag/

Yeah, my numbers are off by quite a bit.

Re: Software is eating the car

#512

Post by iagovar »

elihu wrote: post #441
InitialBP wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mazda hasn't sold a production car with a rotary engine in a while, I believe since the RX-8 went out of production. Due to the nature of rotary engines they inherently have worse emissions (more like a 2-stroke than a 4-stroke) and while people have been hoping for another production rotary from Mazda it's unclear if they will build another one or not.

I'm kind of hoping the LiquidPiston design works out, since in theory it should fix a lot of the fuel economy and emissions issues (combustion chamber is closer to the ideal round shape), and maybe even be lower maintenance (apex seals move to the non-moving part of the engine, where they can be lubricated more easily). It's not owned by Mazda, though, so even if it works it's anyone's guess if Mazda would even be ab…

There's a development here in Spain that seems pretty interesting for range-extenders, by InnEngine. They seem to be in the prototype phase, it's also a pretty interesting design.

Re: Software is eating the car

#513

Post by theluketaylor »

kart23 wrote: post #151
mthomasmw wrote: post #6

Serious question - what alternatives are left for those of us who want a dumb car? I've spent the last three months finding out I can't get solar panels installed without a high-fidelity power-monitor tap connected to the provider's cloud, logging every appliance I use and what it's doing. Same deal with cars - they are on the internet and they generate evidence used to convict, and geofencing is coming. Other than s…

Stockpiling used cars sounds good to me honestly. Land Cruisers are pretty bulletproof, they're regularly on the road through 300,000 miles.

You're late to the Land Cruiser party. Prices for FJ40 went through the roof a few years ago, then FJ60 started to climb, then even 80 and 100 series jumped in value. During the pandemic everyone wanted an overland rig and prices have really shot up in the past year.

https://bringatrailer.com/toyota/land-cruiser-100-series/

Re: Software is eating the car

#514

Post by s_fischer »

wyre wrote: post #234
rootusrootus wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If electric cars ever become widespread Exclude Tesla and most all EVs on the road today are just normal cars that happen to be electric.

Why is special about Tesla that makes them not a “normal” car that happens to be electric?

I think what they were getting at is: there's a minimal difference in terms of "look and feel" between non-tesla EVs and the gas counterparts designed by the same manufacturer.

Tesla very much intends to redefine the driver experience as we know it. In the model 3, the entire control system in the center of the dashboard has been replaced by a giant singular 15" carputer touch screen.

If you don't believe me, you can make the comparison for yourself. Just do an image search for the interior on the Model 3 and compare it to that of a Nissan Leaf or Chevy Bolt.

Re: Software is eating the car

#515

Post by Red_Leaves_Flyy »

MrGilbert wrote: post #465
jacquesm wrote: post #433

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is that you don't know ahead of time when 'sometimes' is which is worse than nothing.

Not that I'm defending the technology in this case, but I notice that some people still believe it's unnecessary to read the user's manual of a modern car. Maybe this mindset has to change.

Maybe the problem is, at best, alpha level software is being field tested by million’s of people with life and death consequences. Cars computer systems should always fail safely. If that can’t be designed right now then test it with professional drivers.

Re: Software is eating the car

#516

Post by Red_Leaves_Flyy »

judge2020 wrote: post #337
cyrks wrote: post #283

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of the main problems is that we have many different software teams trying to solve the same safety feature driven functions in many different ways with many different solutions, outcomes, and decisions along the way. This leads to a very fragmented base of software with varying levels of safety, none of which is tested to the same standards. The result is that consumers don't know of the car they are buying is tr…

This is something agencies like NHTSA and/or private companies like IIHS are supposed to solve, but most active safety technology testing is just ‘does it work’ in very easy scenarios - the test suite needs to include many environments and tough conditions if it wants to evaluate these systems more broadly (The only issue being when car companies optimize for those specific tests, or ‘when the measure becomes a targe…

Anyone want to fund me? I’ll test the every living heck out every smart car in existence in every condition from perfectly flat straight drag steps to dirt roads in the mountains with a foot of snow and white out conditions, to unmarked pot holes riddled roads in torrential down pours. I’ll also test the usual stuff like does the car detect the kids playing in traffic, or the dog darting after the squirrel. I’ll video the test from numerous angles, cut in awesome music and sounds effects and upload everything to the internet. I’ll also write long articles about the intricate nuances of each vehicles responses to the tests and create scoreboards for categories like least likely to run over children, or most likely careen off a bridge if there’s a sign at the perfect angle.

Re: Software is eating the car

#517

Post by mavhc »

randcraw wrote: post #447
mavhc wrote: post #367

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you want to pay more for them?

Adding labor saving devices always increases the price you pay for a product. I LIKE labor saving features, just so long as they don't get in my way or tell me what to do. I just want a car to ENABLE me in intuitive ways and that don't go obsolete before the tires need replacing.

Knobs and sliders and buttons all cost money to create, wire in, fix. 1 touchscreen is cheaper.

Re: Software is eating the car

#518

Post by clairity »

throwaway0a5e wrote: post #506
clairity wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "Modern cars are absolutely terrible in the UX department, but they are a hell of a lot safer, so there’s that." tangentially, "safety" is highly cargo-culted. things that seem so obviously safer are taken without question as better, but in many cases, such features really only provide a false sense of security along with substantive unintended consequences. most safety features in cars (e.g., lane-keeping) allow p…

The "spewing BS is order to show the world how much you care about safety" part of the safety cargo cult bothers me a hell of a lot more than safety features enabling less attentive behavior. If I had a nickle for every social media user who's screeching about how airbags are all that's good in the world but who doesn't understand the inherent tradeoffs to a bag of dense air occupying the space in front of the driver…

yes, it's frenzy, a typically pro-social behavior (agreeableness) that's misapplied due to fear and uncertainty, so that we get counterintuitive consequences from overly correlated belief/behavior.

it's the same impulse that got us mis-masking and lockdowns, when the real danger was inter-/intra-familial contact (because that contact is prolonged and our guards are down, unlike with "stranger danger").

happens all too often, and it's frustrating to watch otherwise perceptive and reasonable people forsake those facilities for primal herd behavior.

Re: Software is eating the car

#519

Post by textman »

SavantIdiot wrote: post #3

Short answer to the lede: no, the industry cannot cope. Or rather, it will limp along with bloatware, bugs, and malware exactly the same way we see desktop OSes bloat, or the way we see routers and set-top boxes hacked to become botnets. In my 40+ years in the industry I've yet to see code get SMALLER. With the exception of Linux kernel 1.0 in the 90's which was a step backwards into smaller, more compact code, code…

Absolutely: Ford logged 100k preorders for the F150 Lightning https://www.businessinsider.com/ford-f150-lightning-electric...

This truck is so software bloated.

Re: Software is eating the car

#520

Post by SavantIdiot »

pgreenwood wrote: post #415
SavantIdiot wrote: post #3

Short answer to the lede: no, the industry cannot cope. Or rather, it will limp along with bloatware, bugs, and malware exactly the same way we see desktop OSes bloat, or the way we see routers and set-top boxes hacked to become botnets. In my 40+ years in the industry I've yet to see code get SMALLER. With the exception of Linux kernel 1.0 in the 90's which was a step backwards into smaller, more compact code, code…

I'm reminded of the joke "If Microsoft Made Cars" from the 90s. http://www.hcs.harvard.edu/pnw/microsoftjoke.htm And 25 years later here we are... ' For all of us who feel only the deepest love and affection for the way computers have enhanced our lives, read on. At a recent computer expo (COMDEX), Bill Gates reportedly compared the computer industry with the auto industry and stated, "If GM had kept up with technolo…

Ha, I remember this! Also, I have a strange feeling that this may end up reality instead of parody.
Post reply on HN