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El Salvador makes Bitcoin legal tender

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Re: El Salvador makes Bitcoin legal tender

#661

Post by reedjosh »

HWR_14 wrote: post #623
reedjosh wrote: post #385

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are wallets that will show a fake lower balance in distress mode. Further, why walk around with all of your BTC available to you? If you really have enough to worry about gangs stealing it, put it in cold storage or on an exchange, but don't carry access to it around in your pocket the same way you wouldn't carry cash around in your pocket.

A fake UI screen? Wow, that's useful. Good thing there isn't an easily verifiable public ledger with the true value of the account that the criminals can check while holding you at gunpoint. Meanwhile, you expect people to have cold storage where? IIRC, they cannot just memorize a private key, but they need an actual file on a device.

No, they can actually just memorize a seed phrase. The distress mode shows an entirely different wallet ID. So, you're wrong on both counts.

https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Seed_phrase

> However, the bitcoin key generated is not the main key. It is effectively a completely separate wallet!

https://coldcardwallet.com/?ref=producthunt

Re: El Salvador makes Bitcoin legal tender

#662

Post by reedjosh »

jokethrowaway wrote: post #651
reedjosh wrote: post #375

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> you need to solve it politically. And what do you do when politics are fully captured by corporate and oligarchical interests? The majority of bitcoiners see no way out of our current political system. The dollar underpins the US hegemony. Bitcoin wouldn't be necessary if the government would allow alternative currencies, but until bitcoin, it had squashed numerous attempts at alternatives. So to say that we need t…

I have a feeling Monero et similia will be banned together with encrypted messaging (encryption = terrorist). We lose more freedom every year at the hands of governments, I don't see why this trend is bound to improve. I think what you do is you flee the country and move somewhere smaller where you have greater freedom and a greater chance at influencing politics. My granddad was putting bombs in nazi buildings, but…

Decentralized exchanges will prevent their ability to ban it.

Re: El Salvador makes Bitcoin legal tender

#663

Post by hn_throwaway_99 »

wraptile wrote: post #204
hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The idea that "normal people" will be able to use bitcoin at all without getting their private keys stolen is laughable. Think of how often online bank accounts get hacked in the US, except the difference now is that your money is gone, permanently.

How do you think bank accounts get hacked? It's much easier to yank a password/credit card number people use daily. The benefit of private key is you only need to use it once. Then store it away in a safe or _bank_. More UX will develop over time as adoption grows. We already have hardware wallets that even babies could use. Finally you somehow imply that FIAT theft doesn't happen. Even in recent modern history peopl…

Basically everything in your post highlights why crypto is a horrible idea for your average person:

> How do you think bank accounts get hacked? It's much easier to yank a password/credit card number people use daily.

Exactly, and when a credit card number is stolen the consumer is almost never liable, as opposed to crypto where your life savings are gone forever.

> The benefit of private key is you only need to use it once. Then store it away in a safe or _bank_.

As another responder said, you need your private key to sign every transaction. Giving you the benefit of the doubt and assuming you're talking about wallet keywords, even then if you have an account you still need the ability to sign transactions, and according to crypto enthusiasts the no-middleman, non-reversability of crypto transactions is a feature, not a bug.

> More UX will develop over time as adoption grows. We already have hardware wallets that even babies could use.

This man used a Trezor wallet but was still tricked into entering his wallet keywords into a fake Trezor app and lost his life savings: https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2021/03/30/trezor-...

> Even in recent modern history people have lost all their savings in a snap be it their house burning down, colleague stealing everything or even your bank going under.

Which is exactly why everyone with a mortgage is required to have home owners insurance, and FDIC insurance exists.

The only way to introduce these kinds of benefits (e.g. to have someone adjudicate allegations of fraud; insurance; etc.) is to introduce middle men, which then defeats the entire purpose of crypto in the first place.

Re: El Salvador makes Bitcoin legal tender

#664

Post by reedjosh »

bun_at_work wrote: post #632
reedjosh wrote: post #480

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It may be fine for the faith in banking structures, but it's not that great it you like your dollars to hold value.

This comment betrays your misunderstanding of the financial institutions and systems at play here. The Fed's goal is to maintain inflation at 2% for reasons more complicated than I'll discuss here. If you're interested here is a source you might like: > https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/30231791-the-end-of-alch...

I understand the goal and all of the justifications of Kaynsian economics. I don't have a misunderstanding of it, but a disagreement with it.

See Bitcoin Standard podcast and or book for more on hard money and economics under it.

https://saifedean.com/thebitcoinstandard/

And or the Mises Institute for the low down on Austrian economic viewpoints that answer many of the questions that Kaynsians can't.

https://mises.org/what-austrian-economics

And on top of that the fed itself says we've already had 4.2% CPI inflation this year.

https://www.bls.gov/cpi/latest-numbers.htm

But, that's trusting the stakeholders in the inflation game to be honest.

If you remove the constant adjustments to the CPI you get a _much_ higher rate of inflation than governments will admit.

http://www.shadowstats.com/alternate_data/inflation-charts

Re: El Salvador makes Bitcoin legal tender

#666

Post by dougSF70 »

JKCalhoun wrote: post #225
dougSF70 wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that using cash makes money expensive which adds some base load inflation - this will help reduces homelessness and other societal ills (such as wealth inequality). Electronic money is never lost, not like those pounds, pennies, dollars, quarters. Losing money, takes out of circulation. While not much is taken out, it might be enough to create a base load of inflation - money becomes more scarce and therefore…

Counterpoint: those pounds, pennies, dollars, quarters never end up in a Nigerian Prince's bank account. Oh, electronic money is "lost" all the time. Alarmingly so. :-)

Moved yes, lost no. That prince will spend it. Unlike Grandma's couch, known to have consumed $000's in its life time.

Re: El Salvador makes Bitcoin legal tender

#667

Post by shp0ngle »

X6S1x6Okd1st wrote: post #488
shp0ngle wrote: post #94

If two Bitcoin forks both claim they are the "real bitcoin", who decides which one is the real legal tender? El Salvador courts?

That's a very good question. IMO it seems pretty unlikely that bitcoin will undergo another fork any time soon, the people that were fine with forking went to BCH and then had many subsequent forks meanwhile the people that stayed on BTC either believed in small blocks or believed in the virtue of not forking.

I have heard some people are planning another UASF with respect to Taproot. Because miners are not agreeing with it.

Re: El Salvador makes Bitcoin legal tender

#668

Post by KingOfCoders »

jbverschoor wrote: post #588
KingOfCoders wrote: post #471

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If everyone has the right to a bank account, bank cant't reject or kick people.

This already is the case in the Netherlands. Don’t you understand? The system is broken

No I don't understand.

Re: El Salvador makes Bitcoin legal tender

#669

Post by TimJRobinson »

Tarq0n wrote: post #646
madacol wrote: post #455

Earlier quoted context omitted.

primarily-online-banks are close to non existent in latinoamerica

I don't see why developing a sophisticated mobile bitcoin payment platform would be any easier.

Because you don't have to deal with custody and regulation. It's just software.

Re: El Salvador makes Bitcoin legal tender

#670

Post by KingOfCoders »

reedjosh wrote: post #440
andyana wrote: post #429

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You mean a safety deposit box at a bank? At a bank most Ecuadorians don't use?

In that case, bury a seed phrase somewhere like hidden treasure. The whole point is that a seed phrase is all that's needed to backup a wallet. It's akin to hiding money in your mattress, but less bulky. You could even memorize it because seed phrases are between 12 and 24 words.

"It's akin to hiding money in your mattress"

So people with money in their mattress and no access to a bank should do an elaborate scheme that ends with "akin to hiding money in your mattress"?

With a treasure map and a cross where the treasure is so your children will find it in need? Then make a movie out of it and become rich?

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