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Apple asks staff to return to office 3 days a week starting in early September

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Re: Apple asks staff to return to office 3 days a week starting in early September

#971

Post by heavyset_go »

_jal wrote: post #831
heavyset_go wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I save money by spending less on food, drinks, and electricity. For those of us who have to commute, it's not exactly the norm to be saving money while commuting. Commutes are responsible for a 10% drop in hourly wages[1], and the median commute time results in spending 10 full days commuting a year. The average commuter in one of the largest metro areas in the country will spend over 13 full days commuting a year:…

> For those of us who have to commute, it's not exactly the norm to be saving money while commuting This is true. I choose to live within walking distance of my office, and it has vastly improved my life - prior to this job, I commuted 2.5 hours a day, and that was awful. These choices of course have complex tradeoffs, but you don't have to commute, it is a choice.

> These choices of course have complex tradeoffs, but you don't have to commute, it is a choice.

I have to live near disabled family members so I can help take care of them. It's either work at Walmart, commute or work remotely. I've done the latter for years, but before the pandemic, most non-remote-first employers' attitudes towards remote working was either simply "no", or there was the expectation that you were to spend a year or more working in the office before asking your employer to make a special case for you to work remotely.

Re: Apple asks staff to return to office 3 days a week starting in early September

#972

Post by read_if_gay_ »

throwaway2037 wrote: post #891
read_if_gay_ wrote: post #704

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> there's much bigger impact to be made if they work from the top down Exactly. Germany banning plastic straws while simultaneously funding a new natural gas pipeline feels very much like they just want it to seem like things are improving.

I'm confused by the second part >. I assume you are talking about Nord Stream 2. Switching from brown coal to natural gas can reduce carbon footprint by about 50%. This is a good stepping stone to reduce the huge amount of brown coal that Germany uses for power. Also, the reduction in NOx and SOx is huge by switching from brown coal to natural gas. Another big win for public health. Do I misunderstand your point? Ger…

It seems you argue it’s a stepping stone, then you argue there’s no other way. Both of these can’t be true.

But if you ask me, the long term answer is nuclear. I know it’s controversial but many of the issues are blown out of proportion.

Re: Apple asks staff to return to office 3 days a week starting in early September

#973

Post by winrid »

crossroadsguy wrote: post #890
winrid wrote: post #555

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you tried setting boundaries and being disciplined about it? I've had to tell people - I won't reply after 5, and no meetings then. People still tried to setup 530, even 730pm meetings all the time (not even during crunch time). Instant decline lol We don't make enough time for our own lives. Hell, it's hard enough to find time to actually make an enjoy a dinner.

I already do that. I still don’t want my home also as a work place.

Totally understandable!

Re: Apple asks staff to return to office 3 days a week starting in early September

#974

Post by intricatedetail »

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #130
dm8 wrote: post #65

I maybe in the minority in this comments section but I genuinely enjoy working from office. I enjoy the social aspects. And commute never bothered me, albeit max commute for me was 45 mins (in the bay area). The only downside that I always felt was parking situation. Lot of my friends feel the same about office work. I believe going forward there will be companies (and employees) in 2 camps -- remote first and hybrid…

> I maybe in the minority in this comments section but I genuinely enjoy working from office. In my experience, plenty of people enjoy working from the office. Many of us enjoy a mix of in-office and WFH. The comments sections on these articles tend to receive a lot of projection from people who simply hate their jobs and view WFH as a partial antidote to that. That, and a lot of comments from people who have absurdl…

People who love to work in the office often lack social skills to find friends outside of work and it is their substitute. What I mean that everyone is different.

Re: Apple asks staff to return to office 3 days a week starting in early September

#975

Post by intricatedetail »

haswell wrote: post #907
game_the0ry wrote: post #902

COVID forced the experiment of full time remote office work on corporations without managers having any influence over how long it would be implemented. So now we know the result of that experiment - just look at the S&P500 / Dow market caps. An over-simplification, I know, but hey, that's price of the stock is the CEO's score card. Corporate middle management and CEOs no longer have any excuse for maintaining the am…

I've been a mostly remote employee (at a company that is mostly not remote) for about 7 years now, so the shift to 100% remote had minimal impact on me, but had immense impact on most of the teams I work with. I think there will be a bit of a pendulum swing as things open up and then a normalization somewhere in the middle. I'm an introvert, and a "Highly Sensitive Person" and I find remote work to be really helpful…

Why "brainstorming" has to be in person? On Slack or other service is much more inclusive as it include voices of people who are not great at getting themselves heard in a live setting but they have great ideas. Plus everything is traceable.

Re: Apple asks staff to return to office 3 days a week starting in early September

#976

Post by rblatz »

mateo411 wrote: post #924
rblatz wrote: post #408

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My electric hits $400+ a month in the summer and it’s just going to get worse when our pool is completed. I live in a new 2500 square foot house in Arizona, our insulation is fine. And we have two pretty nice heat pump/ac units.

Have you considered adding solar panels to your house?

Yes, I’ve been in talks with a Tesla rep. Need to run the numbers on buying vs leasing, and get a few other quotes.

Re: Apple asks staff to return to office 3 days a week starting in early September

#977

Post by Tronno »

dougmwne wrote: post #573
Elora wrote: post #319

Some here are being honest, so I'll be brutally honest: Covid has upset the master-slave relationship, and they're realizing they're giving up too much control. Yes, even the supposedly forward-thinking, progressive tech world. It's so much easier to ignore the BS of "company culture," "a new family" and other such nonsense when working remote. Plenty of people here have outright stated they work as a way to fund the…

Bingo. People who lead companies are not wired like the rest of us. It's not some bullshit about mission or impact. Executives are there for power. Power is the sweat under a subordinate's arms when you address them. Power is having control over the bodies of others when you tell them where to be, how long to be there, where to sit and how to dress. Power is having roomfuls of people in rapt attention to you. Power i…

I don't think what you are describing is a normal work environment. I have experienced something similar though - and it sounds like you work with sociopaths.

If that's the case, the classic advice is to disengage and find another job as soon as possible. Staying will not be healthy for your mind. Good luck.

Re: Apple asks staff to return to office 3 days a week starting in early September

#978

Post by pensatoio »

There’s a lot of great points being made by others, but for me, it boils down to just one.

Privacy.

Offices have no privacy. If my brain is stalling out, there’s nowhere to go to take a 15-30 minute uninterrupted, shameless nap. Bowel movements are subject to crappy, public stalls with big cracks in the doors.

It’s just not worth it. I get way more work done at home, and I’m far more comfortable.

Re: Apple asks staff to return to office 3 days a week starting in early September

#979

Post by haswell »

intricatedetail wrote: post #975
haswell wrote: post #907

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been a mostly remote employee (at a company that is mostly not remote) for about 7 years now, so the shift to 100% remote had minimal impact on me, but had immense impact on most of the teams I work with. I think there will be a bit of a pendulum swing as things open up and then a normalization somewhere in the middle. I'm an introvert, and a "Highly Sensitive Person" and I find remote work to be really helpful…

Why "brainstorming" has to be in person? On Slack or other service is much more inclusive as it include voices of people who are not great at getting themselves heard in a live setting but they have great ideas. Plus everything is traceable.

Not all brainstorming has to be in person. Many things can and should happen asynchronously (even if we're all in the office). But not all forms of collaborative work are equal.

I addressed your question (why does this have to be in person) in another HN thread [0] a number of months back and I'm copying that comment here. The rest of that thread (parent and children) explore this in more depth.

> I'm talking about conversations that might take all day, or days. Breaking down enormous problems. Deep collaborative work. Can you do this in a virtual room? Yes. Will you achieve the same outcome? Early results (in my case) seem to indicate the answer is "no".

> I want the ability to pace around the room at times. Look my collaborators in the eye. Pick up on non-verbal cues that are often impossible to see remotely. Step away as a group to share a much needed lunch break.

> And when passionate people are involved, and many viewpoints are present, the ability to all argue/debate a topic vigorously - even show frustration at the right moments - and then all share a beer at the end of the day, is critical. Having that same vigorous debate on Zoom and then dropping off to our individual lives doesn't leave room for reconnecting with each other as humans - something that is critical for maintaining relationships.

> Not every project requires this kind of interaction. But for things that do, the remote format just doesn't work well for everyone.

- [0] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24793079

Re: Apple asks staff to return to office 3 days a week starting in early September

#980

Post by canogat »

pensatoio wrote: post #978

There’s a lot of great points being made by others, but for me, it boils down to just one. Privacy. Offices have no privacy. If my brain is stalling out, there’s nowhere to go to take a 15-30 minute uninterrupted, shameless nap. Bowel movements are subject to crappy, public stalls with big cracks in the doors. It’s just not worth it. I get way more work done at home, and I’m far more comfortable.

Speaking of BMs, WFH has me spoiled in that I get to use the bidet I installed at home every time. Once you’re used to using a bidet, anything less feels like living in the dark ages.
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