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Apple asks staff to return to office 3 days a week starting in early September

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Re: Apple asks staff to return to office 3 days a week starting in early September

#901

Post by throwaway2037 »

enriquto wrote: post #713
heavyset_go wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I save money by spending less on food, drinks, and electricity. For those of us who have to commute, it's not exactly the norm to be saving money while commuting. Commutes are responsible for a 10% drop in hourly wages[1], and the median commute time results in spending 10 full days commuting a year. The average commuter in one of the largest metro areas in the country will spend over 13 full days commuting a year:…

> Commutes are responsible for a 10% drop in hourly wages Maybe statistically, OK. But if you have a nice commute it may be likely the best part of your day. I have a mostly flat, 40 min bike ride in the woods every day, and it is my "me time" that I cherish and lets me unwind before and after work. Definitely not "lost time".

You should post a video of it on YouTube (or somewhere else you prefer). A lot of people might enjoy it... a bit like Norweigan "slow TV".

Re: Apple asks staff to return to office 3 days a week starting in early September

#902

Post by game_the0ry »

COVID forced the experiment of full time remote office work on corporations without managers having any influence over how long it would be implemented.

So now we know the result of that experiment - just look at the S&P500 / Dow market caps. An over-simplification, I know, but hey, that's price of the stock is the CEO's score card.

Corporate middle management and CEOs no longer have any excuse for maintaining the amount of office space that they do, so they're now resorting to empty, superficial reasoning. Case in point:

> "Cook wrapped up the memo by saying that he's looking forward to seeing employee faces. "I know I'm not alone in missing the hum of activity, the energy, creativity and collaboration of our in-person meetings and the sense of community we've all built," he wrote."

The CEO needs to be an extraverted person, the role requires that type of personality, especially for a high profile corporation like Apple. Therefore, CEO needs to twist his brain into mental gymnastics in order to justify the 10 year lease s/he signed just 2 years ago ( or in the case of Apple, the capital expense of Apple's big, round HQ building).

"Synergy! Cross pollination of ideation! Innovation! Business jargon! MBA buzzwords!" - so says every American CEO.

yawn

Personally, I did enjoy office time pre COVID, but the commute nowadays (I have to take public transportation bc I live in NYC) is not something I look forward to. I also know I have been more productive.

So we all have to suffer a little more so that the CEOs and middle managers feelings feel better, but at least remote work will be more common than ever before.

Re: Apple asks staff to return to office 3 days a week starting in early September

#903

Post by throwaway2037 »

Closi wrote: post #563
radec wrote: post #461

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm glad others are shocked by that $60/day on food. I would say food takes up the largest percentage of my expenses and $60 is easily 5 days worth of food for two.

The $60 is laughably high, but the value of the perk of $400 a month might also be too low considering part of the appeal is presumably that it all gets looked after for you and you don’t have to prep food or even think about your meals (the value of having all your meals cooked for you isn’t the same as the value of the ingredients).

I read a bunch of comments in this branch, and I think yours nails it. Initially, I saw 60 USD per day and laughed. Thought to myself: "Ok, they will all be overweight in 1 yr -- like junior bankers!" Then, I realised the labour costs are pretty high, so 60 USD per day might be too low. It might be closer to 100 USD in "value" per day for Google to provide all your meals.

Re: Apple asks staff to return to office 3 days a week starting in early September

#904

Post by Plyphon_ »

onion2k wrote: post #522
Maxion wrote: post #502

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Europe your employer can't provide you with free food, it's value is counted as taxable income.

Europe is made up of 27 countries all with their own tax laws. You can't make generalisations like that without significantly more detail. Here in the UK my employer can and occasionally, but not frequently enough in my opinion, does pay for my lunch.

There are 51 countries in Europe, if you count some technicalities around the Vatican, Monaco etc.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_European_countries_by_...

Though I suspect both yourself and the previous poster was referring to the European Union.

Re: Apple asks staff to return to office 3 days a week starting in early September

#905

Post by room505 »

I enjoy working at home just as much as the next person. I think many would agree that interaction in a school environment is important for people when learning. My point is that many forget that new employees, especially young people starting their career need interaction in order to learn and grow in their field. My employer is asking us to come in at least two days a week, which seems like a nice balance. In my field of architecture, nothing beats human interaction when designing and helping others in building and construction.

Re: Apple asks staff to return to office 3 days a week starting in early September

#906

Post by pmontra »

Nbox9 wrote: post #51

I work for another company that is going to do a partial return to office. I will be looking at options for companies that offer full in person office (or 90% in person office) after things settle down. I have worked full remote for a total of 5 years of my career, and I believe working in the office is a competitive advantage. * Overhearing hallway conversations (and joining them) helps spawn invocation. * I often d…

I've been self employed and mostly working from home since 2006 and yet I'm with you that "working in the office is a competitive advantage." Not for me because I'm self employed, but I believe it is for people working in companies with other people in the office close to the eyes and ears of their managers.

I saw it happen 25+ years ago when working from home wasn't a thing. I worked for a consulting company. We had about half of our workforce working at customer premises. Not low fee body rental but projects that had to be run there. Well, the people getting advances in pay and career were mostly the people working in the headquarter. Managers of successful remote teams got career advances, some key remote developer got them too (customers wanted them) but most of them were forgotten wheels of the company machine.

But I'm in no competition with colleagues so working from home is great. I won't go back unless I'll ever start starving.

Re: Apple asks staff to return to office 3 days a week starting in early September

#907

Post by haswell »

game_the0ry wrote: post #902

COVID forced the experiment of full time remote office work on corporations without managers having any influence over how long it would be implemented. So now we know the result of that experiment - just look at the S&P500 / Dow market caps. An over-simplification, I know, but hey, that's price of the stock is the CEO's score card. Corporate middle management and CEOs no longer have any excuse for maintaining the am…

I've been a mostly remote employee (at a company that is mostly not remote) for about 7 years now, so the shift to 100% remote had minimal impact on me, but had immense impact on most of the teams I work with.

I think there will be a bit of a pendulum swing as things open up and then a normalization somewhere in the middle.

I'm an introvert, and a "Highly Sensitive Person" and I find remote work to be really helpful for me. But as a product manager, the shift to 100% remote, especially by folks who are not accustomed to it, wreaked havoc on some of the planning/design/brainstorming work we generally do in person between each release.

I'm very happy that there's some return to normalcy. I hope the pendulum doesn't swing too far, and I hope that companies focus on working onsite when it makes sense instead of just because.

But I do think you're right about CEOs, manager types and some extroverts - some will look for any reason they can to go "back to normal".

Re: Apple asks staff to return to office 3 days a week starting in early September

#908

Post by DataGata »

mssundaram wrote: post #616
Solvitieg wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Considering that we spend most of our day doing this "work" thing, I find it much more tolerable to view my coworkers as close friends and my career as an opportunity. This is especially easy in such a privileged sector as tech where pay is excellent, office life is compelling, and work is challenging and exciting. I don't know how people survive day-to-day with a perspective like yours. I get that people can get ful…

Have you ever been fired from your family? For some that analogy has happened, but for most people it's an exception, but for a job it's a much more real possibility. I'm a mercenary at my job. No allegiance but to my interests, because the leadership and shareholders have the same perspective

Are you responding to the parent comment? Do you not see how "I'm a mercenary" is as toxic as "I hustle 12 hours a day everyday"?

Re: Apple asks staff to return to office 3 days a week starting in early September

#909

Post by k-mcgrady »

P_I_Staker wrote: post #833
ferdowsi wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Since starting to work remote I've discovered the power of shutting down the work laptop (not sleeping) at a set time and not looking back. No Slack or work email on the phone. When I look back on hallway conversations, I can't think of many that really mattered. Actual important decisions are typically not made by IC engineers. Relevant conversations are usually inside team structures and not spontaneous.

> Since starting to work remote I've discovered the power of shutting down the work laptop (not sleeping) at a set time and not looking back. No Slack or work email on the phone. What!?!? I don't necessarily agree with OP, but this is the exact opposite of my experience (mostly observing others). One of the main downsides of WFH is the "always on" nature of it. I usually left my laptop at work, and ignored my phone b…

How do you get randomly pinged outside working hours? Is Slack on your personal phone? If so, delete it. Keep your work emails closed (and not on your personal phone). Use a separate browser profile for work/personal if you are working on your personal laptop.

I sympathise with people finding it hard to switch off (I was one until I did all of the above) but it's a simple problem to solve and it's absolutely nothing to do with WFH.

Re: Apple asks staff to return to office 3 days a week starting in early September

#910

Post by throwaway2037 »

ir123 wrote: post #718
radec wrote: post #461

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm glad others are shocked by that $60/day on food. I would say food takes up the largest percentage of my expenses and $60 is easily 5 days worth of food for two.

My total expenses for groceries and vegetables is less than $60 for a full month in India.

Why was this downvoted? It's useful anecdata. Thank you to share.

At wet markets in China/HK/TW/SE Asia, you might be able to eat for a month on 60 USD.

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